(;GM[1]FF[4]CA[UTF-8]AP[CGoban:3]ST[2] RU[Japanese]SZ[19]KM[6.50]TM[3600] GN[Pandanet European Team Championships 2013, r1]DT[2013-09-24]RO[1]PC[The KGS Go Server at http://www.gokgs.com/]C[Tien [9d?\]: Now let's see if we actually get people in Tien [9d?\]: Otherwise it becomes like doing offline reviews for SGL Finnish8d [-\]: right : ) Tien [9d?\]: ...And I don't think that's what we really want Kettu [?\]: hello Finnish8d [-\]: hi ^^ Tien [9d?\]: Namii was going to come, too Tien [9d?\]: Oh, and Mokki Tien [9d?\]: Five would be good enough, I guess Kettu [?\]: prodi is at least around too, does he know about this Tien [9d?\]: I dropped him a message earlier Tien [9d?\]: Looks like he's away from keyboard Tien [9d?\]: Well, in the meanwhile when waiting for more people, I think we can write in this file what we have already concluded from my and Namii's games Tien [9d?\]: (We already reviewed them by the three of us) Tien [9d?\]: We just need to recap what we'd discussed earlier, maybe in slightly more detail Tien [9d?\]: Jeff continues? Finnish8d [-\]: sure Tien [9d?\]: Alright Finnish8d [-\]: just have to find the related game ^^ ]LT[]NB[33]NW[34]RR[Normal] (;B[pd]BL[3584]C[Black: Javier-Aleksi Savolainen White: Oleg Mezhov] ;W[dp]WL[3582]C[Tien [9d?\]: Assu should be black ] ;B[pq]BL[3578] ;W[dc]WL[3576] ;B[ql]BL[3570] ;W[nc]WL[3403] ;B[pf]BL[3562] ;W[jd]WL[3384] ;B[fq]BL[3341] ;W[cn]WL[3263] ;B[jp]BL[3325] ;W[ol]WL[3168]C[Mokki [3d\]: is P8 normal? Finnish8d [-\]: No :P Prodigious [3d?\]: approaching q3 would be normal Tien [9d?\]: I think it's been in a pro game once or twice Prodigious [3d?\]: or wait Prodigious [3d?\]: micro-chinese Finnish8d [-\]: ah ok I see Tien [9d?\]: Jeff, can you take control? Tien [9d?\]: I'll make a few database searches Finnish8d [-\]: ok : ) Finnish8d [-\]: I've never see this happening in micro chinese Finnish8d [-\]: in normal Chinese yes Tien [9d?\]: Ah, true ] ;B[pj]BL[2976] ;W[oo]WL[3105] ;B[np]BL[2913] ;W[qo]WL[3081] (;B[dm]BL[2674]C[Namii [9d\]: Or maybe S5, that's not bad Tien [9d?\]: Huh Namii [9d\]: I don't know what Assu wants to achieve with this shoulder hit :) Finnish8d [-\]: I don't know why here Mokki [3d\]: assu playing very fast :) Tien [9d?\]: Yeah ok, nothing like this has happened in a pro game, no luck with database search Tien [9d?\]: But maybe Jeff can continue with the control in this game Prodigious [3d?\]: black gets r4 in the end Finnish8d [-\]: ok ^^ Prodigious [3d?\]: on move 65 Finnish8d [-\]: sure, I will do this one mainly ^^ Tien [9d?\]: That's way too late ] ;W[fp]WL[2958]C[Prodigious [3d?\]: yeah Finnish8d [-\]: And w is also funny ^^ ] ;B[gp]BL[2643] ;W[fo]WL[2950] (;B[cm]BL[2620]C[Mokki [3d\]: looks like this is a battle of spirit Tien [9d?\]: Strengthen the black side that had weaknesses Tien [9d?\]: "Thanks" Prodigious [3d?\]: b not playing e3 and r4 ] ;W[eq]WL[2832] ;B[gq]BL[2606] ;W[bn]WL[2776]C[Namii [9d\]: C11 doesn't exactly make you a base ] (;B[cf]BL[2538]C[Finnish8d [-\]: in general I agree with this approach, but of course not earlier C7 Tien [9d?\]: Right ] ;W[di]WL[2742]C[Tien [9d?\]: Well, now the d7 stones can be kinda forgotten for the time being Tien [9d?\]: But that doesn't make the corner result really good, anyway Finnish8d [-\]: nothing too good here anymore Tien [9d?\]: Yeah, must be the corner now Namii [9d\]: Yeah I would play this move too ] ;B[cc]BL[2438]C[Tien [9d?\]: Same here ] ;W[cd]WL[2378] ;B[dd]BL[2435] ;W[bc]WL[2377] ;B[cb]BL[2432] ;W[de]WL[2375] ;B[ed]BL[2430] ;W[ce]WL[2374]C[Mokki [3d\]: b D7 stones seem a bit isolated Kettu [?\]: somehow feels b got tricked Tien [9d?\]: I don't get why black let white get e3 Finnish8d [-\]: yeah it is Namii [9d\]: I agree that E3 was better.. Black's rhythm is bad now Tien [9d?\]: Black could get it for free, right? Namii [9d\]: E3 was big Prodigious [3d?\]: there are many mysteries in this game ] ;B[bb]BL[2428] ;W[gd]WL[2306] ;B[fe]BL[1993] ;W[df]WL[2283] ;B[ge]BL[1989] ;W[gb]WL[1900] ;B[hc]BL[1824]C[Namii [9d\]: Black finally took gote anyway ^^ Namii [9d\]: So perhaps better to omit these Tien [9d?\]: Any reason not to just play e18? Finnish8d [-\]: right, but they were fighting for sente : ) Finnish8d [-\]: gote is the reason ^^ Namii [9d\]: Yeah. White F16-E15 was also a bad exchange by white's part Finnish8d [-\]: I understand players, but it is gote anyway, yes Tien [9d?\]: And there seems to be nothing incredibly urgent on the board in the sense that you should fight for the sente Tien [9d?\]: Or well, there is, r4 and d9 and q18, but there's too many of those :) Finnish8d [-\]: yeah Namii [9d\]: Except maybe the lower right ] ;W[hd]WL[1892]C[Mokki [3d\]: playing at C11 is bad instead of C14? ] ;B[ec]BL[1816]C[Tien [9d?\]: I just cannot imagine them now going back to r4 ] ;W[fd]WL[1855] ;B[ee]BL[1802]C[Namii [9d\]: I feel it's the hottest area on the board Tien [9d?\]: The time for that was a long time ago Namii [9d\]: Hehe Kettu [?\]: i thought B11 was the reason to fight for sente Finnish8d [-\]: ah Finnish8d [-\]: left side Finnish8d [-\]: well b 2 stones you may just leave it there Finnish8d [-\]: or it is minus point anyway Tien [9d?\]: B11 feels odd when white has b6 in place Kettu [?\]: yes, but maybe b can harass white group just a little bit :) Tien [9d?\]: It'll be hard for black to get eyes there anyway Namii [9d\]: White can resist with C10 to B11? Tien [9d?\]: I'd just play c11, I guess Namii [9d\]: Simple enough Tien [9d?\]: Though actually c13 would feel really solid too Namii [9d\]: C13 is the instinct.. B still needs to add a move then and white takes sente Tien [9d?\]: Right Namii [9d\]: that way of play feels heavy for black ] ;W[ck]WL[1750]C[Tien [9d?\]: H17 I really cannot get :) Kettu [?\]: mm Prodigious [3d?\]: c9 feels dull Mokki [3d\]: i like D9 Prodigious [3d?\]: since black isn't going to do anything with the two stones anyway Tien [9d?\]: I'd play high Prodigious [3d?\]: should be more urgent points elsewhere Finnish8d [-\]: should be high, just want to say this Finnish8d [-\]: if w wants to play here ] ;B[pm]BL[1246]C[Namii [9d\]: I also made the mistake in EGC, of 'low attacking' :P Namii [9d\]: typical 5-6d mistake Finnish8d [-\]: ^^ Finnish8d [-\]: anyway, so let's turn to bottom right Finnish8d [-\]: b this peep... Tien [9d?\]: Still wrong direction Namii [9d\]: Is R7 better locally Namii [9d\]: but yeah, it should be at R4, right? Tien [9d?\]: If you really have to play there, yes Tien [9d?\]: But nothing is as big as r4 here Finnish8d [-\]: right Finnish8d [-\]: guess b is not doing attacking to gain here ] (;W[no]WL[1430]C[Tien [9d?\]: Should white just take the corner instead? Finnish8d [-\]: of course w should :P Tien [9d?\]: And not care about the outside Tien [9d?\]: Hehe Finnish8d [-\]: and now I feel like the players thinki alike ^^ ] ;B[mp]BL[1240]C[Tien [9d?\]: Or, they're saying "no" to each other in the extreme way Finnish8d [-\]: yeah Mokki [3d\]: if w takes corner, then D7 stones could become good sacrifices ] ;W[mo]WL[1428] ;B[lp]BL[1225] ;W[nj]WL[1378]C[Finnish8d [-\]: w contributed huge here Namii [9d\]: In this game the center is valueless Namii [9d\]: so these moves don't do much Namii [9d\]: I feel b gained here :P Tien [9d?\]: Definitely Mokki [3d\]: now Q18 b? ] ;B[kd]BL[988]C[Tien [9d?\]: Possibly q18, yes Namii [9d\]: Assu wants to make use of H17 Tien [9d?\]: But that's not our logic in thisgame, it seems Tien [9d?\]: Or the players', anyway Namii [9d\]: If black L17, he can M17 Finnish8d [-\]: not the players, yeah Mokki [3d\]: does b maybe feel to be behind? Finnish8d [-\]: ah not really Finnish8d [-\]: they just do it this way Finnish8d [-\]: and they both Tien [9d?\]: :D Mokki [3d\]: no, i mean like b:s play feels like he is thinking to be a bit behind Finnish8d [-\]: I don't know how to explain, but I understand them : ) Tien [9d?\]: Mokki, I think Jeff understood you Mokki [3d\]: ok Finnish8d [-\]: yeah I do ^^ Finnish8d [-\]: I mean, players just prefer to fight in this game Tien [9d?\]: It's just that the moves so far have created this kind of an atmosphere for this game :) Finnish8d [-\]: even if they are not behind Tien [9d?\]: So they'll continue with obscure ideas Namii [9d\]: Many ways to play go :P And I don't think neither one of them can clearly say they are ahead or behind Namii [9d\]: a lot of potential everywhere ] ;W[jc]WL[738]C[Namii [9d\]: After L16-K17, maybe then Q18? Tien [9d?\]: K17 sure feels passive, though Namii [9d\]: Since this exchange black gains Tien [9d?\]: Right Finnish8d [-\]: we may say w feels leading by this move ] ;B[lc]BL[495]C[Tien [9d?\]: That's probably really not the case, but that's what white says he's feeling Tien [9d?\]: Maybe m17 is the opposite, then? Namii [9d\]: This is not a move I would easily play Namii [9d\]: I feel black is busier when white jumps to O15 Tien [9d?\]: Yeah Finnish8d [-\]: sure Tien [9d?\]: M17 wants to fight with the super strong white k17 group ] ;W[ne]WL[703]C[Mokki [3d\]: maybe b can get a nice profit with P17? Finnish8d [-\]: ah ok, so w faces to it Namii [9d\]: You'd take the corner? Namii [9d\]: That's interesting too ^^ Finnish8d [-\]: corner is always bigger : ) Namii [9d\]: If black cuts off O17, then black is directly next to white's strong group Namii [9d\]: but O15 is "Russian style" :P Tien [9d?\]: Hmm, I guess I'd take the corner as well Namii [9d\]: and my 1st instinct too 8) Finnish8d [-\]: ^^ Tien [9d?\]: Mainly because o15 is a small area Tien [9d?\]: Or m17, more precisely Namii [9d\]: Yeah ] ;B[oh]BL[407]C[Kettu [?\]: is this "i'm winning"? :) (P12) Namii [9d\]: Assu's logic is clear, but can he really handle this? Finnish8d [-\]: Ah you understand? Tien [9d?\]: I'm sorry, I didn't see the logic Namii [9d\]: Assu wanted to induce white to jump to O15 so he could play at P12 Finnish8d [-\]: I don't understand this P12 Tien [9d?\]: Me and Jeff think alike :) Namii [9d\]: It's not easy to deal with L16 still Namii [9d\]: Oh wait, he sacced it? Namii [9d\]: Hmm.. :) Namii [9d\]: Ok, I'm just guessing :P Let's move on Finnish8d [-\]: let me see what happened first maybe ] ;W[kf]WL[503] ;B[oc]BL[338]C[Tien [9d?\]: Right ] ;W[nb]WL[489]C[Namii [9d\]: After M17 I think black is committed ] ;B[mh]BL[314]C[Tien [9d?\]: So black traded dame stones for an easy capture on m17 Namii [9d\]: Maybe black should play L15 here Finnish8d [-\]: so why b invaded at the first point? Mokki [3d\]: I feel like if b wants P12, he should just play P17 instead of M17. W islikely to play O16 and b can get O18 Tien [9d?\]: Not time trouble, either Tien [9d?\]: Black's not in byo-yomi yet Namii [9d\]: Q18 instead of M17 was my feeling Namii [9d\]: Since with the L16-K17 exchange, black already gained Finnish8d [-\]: ah ok Finnish8d [-\]: so you may also sacrifice those guys for corner and P12? Namii [9d\]: But yeah, how about L15 here? Namii [9d\]: No, before, instead of M17 Finnish8d [-\]: ah ok ^^ Finnish8d [-\]: sure ] ;W[ng]WL[448] ;B[nh]BL[290] ;W[mg]WL[159]C[Namii [9d\]: I guess L15 is heavy though... well, black's play in general was a bit heavy here Tien [9d?\]: At least finally we get r4 ] ;B[qp]BL[275]C[Namii [9d\]: Yup ] ;W[rp]WL[114] ;B[rq]BL[245] ;W[lj]WL[68] ;B[jm]BL[187]C[Tien [9d?\]: K7 is another dame Finnish8d [-\]: because b wants to attack this whole w group Finnish8d [-\]: so he got R4 ] ;W[km]WL[15]C[Namii [9d\]: Hard to understand :P Finnish8d [-\]: I need some cold waster first, sorry Finnish8d [-\]: :P Namii [9d\]: If white makes K7 stronger, it weakens white's left side's potential... Finnish8d [-\]: so ok Finnish8d [-\]: b K7 is to threat w group Finnish8d [-\]: and w calls it ] ;B[kl]BL[134] ;W[ll]WL[595] (;B[jl]BL[566]C[Finnish8d [-\]: sure ] ;W[kn]WL[566] ;B[fm]BL[559] ;W[gm]WL[518] ;B[gl]BL[532] ;W[gn]WL[513] ;B[lm]BL[380]C[Namii [9d\]: But this plan is not entirely bad either, is it? Finnish8d [-\]: it is a plan yes ^^ Finnish8d [-\]: but this one... Namii [9d\]: if K7 was a bluff, white called it and black got what he wanted :P Finnish8d [-\]: I didn't expect Namii [9d\]: B wants to make sure he has a back door Finnish8d [-\]: can Namii explain for b on this? Tien [9d?\]: Take it? Namii [9d\]: If white plays N8 (the shape), black has M6 back door available Finnish8d [-\]: sure w should have taken it ^^ Namii [9d\]: So Assu wants to force this question right now Tien [9d?\]: Oh, m6 ] (;W[fl]WL[274]C[Finnish8d [-\]: but this counter Finnish8d [-\]: I don't know how to comment :P Tien [9d?\]: Haha Tien [9d?\]: Just n8, thanks ] (;B[ln]BL[363]C[Tien [9d?\]: Or that Finnish8d [-\]: ok, so you think this is ok? Tien [9d?\]: For black, sure Finnish8d [-\]: ok Finnish8d [-\]: cos I want to atari N8 Tien [9d?\]: Me too, but it doesn't clearly fix the situation, still ] ;W[mm]WL[264]C[Tien [9d?\]: So this feels easier Finnish8d [-\]: ok ^^ ] ;B[lo]BL[356] ;W[mk]WL[243] ;B[ci]BL[278]C[Tien [9d?\]: Ok, so left side decides Tien [9d?\]: Yeah, c11 is good feeling ] ;W[dj]WL[228] ;B[fk]BL[274] ;W[el]WL[223] ;B[dg]BL[225] ;W[eg]WL[221] ;B[dh]BL[215] ;W[eh]WL[218] ;B[bg]BL[213] ;W[ef]WL[200] ;B[bj]BL[196] ;W[bk]WL[183] ;B[be]BL[187] ;W[bd]WL[180]C[Namii [9d\]: Now white has E18 though Finnish8d [-\]: yeah that is probably the next decisive one ] ;B[bh]BL[177] ;W[eb]WL[173]C[Finnish8d [-\]: yeah ok Finnish8d [-\]: feels like b survives, b wins right? Tien [9d?\]: One-lane street Tien [9d?\]: Yeah ] ;B[fc]BL[171] ;W[gc]WL[164] ;B[fb]BL[168] ;W[fa]WL[163] ;B[db]BL[167] ;W[ea]WL[158] ;B[gg]BL[156]C[Tien [9d?\]: Though that's what happened, and black still lost ] ;W[gi]WL[150] ;B[he]BL[149]C[Tien [9d?\]: So there may have been an endgame mistake ] ;W[ie]WL[134] (;B[ig]BL[138] ;W[if]WL[128] ;B[hf]BL[134] ;W[hh]WL[123] ;B[hg]BL[133] ;W[qc]WL[102]C[Namii [9d\]: Huh, if you play H15 Namii [9d\]: why not hane at J14 then? Tien [9d?\]: Right Namii [9d\]: You get the table shape immediately if white follows you ] ;B[qd]BL[122] ;W[ae]WL[60] ;B[bf]BL[119] ;W[in]WL[36] ;B[jn]BL[115] ;W[hl]WL[486]C[Namii [9d\]: Since black group is still not fully alive, it's a burden for later ] ;B[ob]BL[596]C[Namii [9d\]: That can make a difference of 0.5-1 moves Namii [9d\]: Hmm, maybe nto though Finnish8d [-\]: how can w trade top right corner with just G8? Namii [9d\]: since there's nothing happening at the center anymore Namii [9d\]: Yeah, Q18 should be a lot bigger than H8, right? Finnish8d [-\]: not really comparable Namii [9d\]: Ah hmm Namii [9d\]: if black pulls back at H8 Namii [9d\]: black E9 is annoying Namii [9d\]: but still, w can protect then? Finnish8d [-\]: right Finnish8d [-\]: but ok, let's move on ] ;W[oa]WL[476] ;B[nd]BL[575] ;W[md]WL[468] ;B[od]BL[571] ;W[mc]WL[363] ;B[pa]BL[569] ;W[na]WL[360] ;B[pb]BL[568] ;W[pp]WL[281] ;B[qq]BL[566] ;W[rn]WL[276] ;B[rm]BL[548] ;W[ab]WL[246] ;B[kg]BL[535] ;W[lg]WL[241] ;B[kh]BL[507] ;W[lh]WL[240] ;B[jj]BL[461]C[Tien [9d?\]: So then, white was ahead earlier too? Tien [9d?\]: Because like this, the endgame seemed to go well for black, who still lost Finnish8d [-\]: yeah, since b actually got a lot in yose ] ;W[ki]WL[234] ;B[ih]BL[431] ;W[og]WL[223] ;B[pg]BL[428] ;W[pk]WL[200] ;B[qk]BL[424] ;W[oj]WL[196] ;B[pi]BL[422] ;W[hj]WL[180]C[Tien [9d?\]: Which means that m17 or so will have been the losing move ] ;B[gh]BL[407] ;W[hi]WL[173] ;B[da]BL[405] ;W[ga]WL[169] ;B[ba]BL[397] ;W[ip]WL[150] ;B[iq]BL[392] ;W[jo]WL[143] ;B[ko]BL[390] ;W[io]WL[141] ;B[jq]BL[382] ;W[er]WL[118] ;B[fr]BL[377] ;W[op]WL[116] ;B[oq]BL[375] ;W[aj]WL[89] ;B[ai]BL[372] ;W[ak]WL[85] ;B[es]BL[339] ;W[ds]WL[84] ;B[fs]BL[337] ;W[dr]WL[599] ;B[sp]BL[570] ;W[ro]WL[592] ;B[pn]BL[566] ;W[po]WL[581] ;B[mn]BL[561]C[Namii [9d\]: Ok, let's move onto the next game? ] ;W[om]WL[578] ;B[nm]BL[559] ;W[ml]WL[534] ;B[nn]BL[553] ;W[on]WL[533] ;B[mi]BL[545] ;W[li]WL[524] ;B[nl]BL[532] ;W[ok]WL[500] ;B[kk]BL[520] ;W[mj]WL[494] ;B[cj]BL[517] ;W[fi]WL[404] ;B[sm]BL[503] ;W[pl]WL[394] ;B[qm]BL[502] ;W[ff]WL[379] ;B[ij]BL[488] ;W[oe]WL[345] ;B[hp]BL[468] ;W[pe]WL[333] ;B[qe]BL[467] ;W[im]WL[323] ;B[of]BL[458] ;W[nf]WL[321]C[Tien [9d?\]: Maybe yours then? Finnish8d [-\]: b did get a lot in yose Finnish8d [-\]: alright Namii [9d\]: Okays ] ;B[ik]BL[440] ;W[hk]WL[291] ;B[jf]BL[434] ;W[je]WL[288] ;B[jg]BL[432] ;W[ji]WL[284] ;B[ii]BL[429] ;W[ho]WL[273] ;B[af]BL[416] ;W[ad]WL[270] ;B[fh]BL[391] ;W[oi]WL[254] ;B[ph]BL[388] ;W[so]WL[249] ;B[sq]BL[385] ;W[go]WL[243] ;B[il]BL[379] ;W[ei]WL[232] ;B[ke]BL[360] ;W[lf]WL[594] ;B[kj]BL[573] ;W[kc]WL[587] ;B[lk]BL[566] ;W[ac]WL[580] ;B[gf]BL[560] ;W[fg]WL[578] ;B[jh]BL[558] ;W[qn]WL[575] ;B[nk]BL[556] ;W[ni]WL[574] ;B[sn]BL[554] ;W[aa]WL[571] ;B[]BL[546] ;W[]WL[569] ;B[]BL[546] ;TW[ha][ia][ja][ka][la][ma][hb][ib][jb][kb][lb][mb][hc][ic][lc][id][kd][ld][ke][le][me][mf][ej][fj][gj][dk][ek][fk][gk][al][bl][cl][dl][gl][am][bm][cm][dm][em][fm][hm][an][dn][en][fn][hn][ao][bo][co][do][eo][ap][bp][cp][ep][aq][bq][cq][dq][ar][br][cr][as][bs][cs]TB[ca][qa][ra][sa][qb][rb][sb][dc][pc][qc][rc][sc][rd][sd][re][se][qf][rf][sf][ag][cg][qg][rg][sg][ah][ch][qh][rh][sh][bi][qi][ri][si][qj][rj][sj][jk][rk][sk][rl][sl][km][kn][kp][hq][kq][lq][mq][nq][gr][hr][ir][jr][kr][lr][mr][nr][or][pr][qr][rr][sr][gs][hs][is][js][ks][ls][ms][ns][os][ps][qs][rs][ss]OS[A4417151][CRGfVeOf][CRMtldDt][CReAAABp][Fiskars][HaidateM][M2307][Mandrau][OMarchine][Oni][RINGO55][RURUTA][TAKA203][TK3][TT1225][Tessin][Tsuneo][aa4318][ag1773][aoiaoi][baldur][betterlife][breakfast][daliu][f1220][fiters][gandhi][ganimedes][gokiti][inosisi][iwamiya][k5331imura][koutouen][krymktk][lj153351][maigo3][marbella][miyarink2][namigonn][nantaisan][nk283][nogami][nontac][okinawa204][okk3838][pitas2012][pochi11][saemonn][sjsycsj][takamu][takaou18][tetusi2][uncle7][wesley2013][yo6266][yurta][yuta3]) (;B[if]C[Tien [9d?\]: So he was afraid of white j13 Namii [9d\]: That's the only logic why I'd play H15 :P Namii [9d\]: Hmm... ] ;W[ig]C[Namii [9d\]: Is that a reason to be afraid of Namii [9d\]: atari+connect Tien [9d?\]: ...Or something Tien [9d?\]: I don't know Tien [9d?\]: But I don't see logic otherwise Namii [9d\]: Yeah, we are trying to follow the logic :P ] ;B[je] ;W[id] ;B[jf]C[Namii [9d\]: W dares to K13? Finnish8d [-\]: w is not crazy enough to do K13 I guess? Finnish8d [-\]: yeah exactly my question ^^ Namii [9d\]: I can't believe it would work Finnish8d [-\]: ah well Finnish8d [-\]: let's see the game ])) (;B[ml])) (;W[mm]C[Namii [9d\]: So here M9 ] ;B[lk] ;W[ml]C[Namii [9d\]: Not a big deal Finnish8d [-\]: and? Tien [9d?\]: Ah, I thought l6 instead of n7 Tien [9d?\]: Just for the k6 cut ] ;B[jn] ;W[ko]C[Finnish8d [-\]: I just feel like K6 is b gote anyway ^^ Tien [9d?\]: Hmm, true Tien [9d?\]: Oh well ]) (;W[jn]) (;W[ln]C[Finnish8d [-\]: Ah I see ])) (;B[kn] ;W[lm]C[Namii [9d\]: Doesn't work in the end ] ;B[ob]C[Finnish8d [-\]: I think this is still bigger? Mokki [3d\]: why not play M7 instead of L6? Finnish8d [-\]: ah M7? ]) (;B[lm] ;W[kn]C[Namii [9d\]: White can atari at K8 ] ;B[ln]C[Tien [9d?\]: Hmm Namii [9d\]: I just checked this :D Namii [9d\]: since I wondered about it too Tien [9d?\]: k8 m5 l9 p7 ] ;W[jl] ;B[lo]C[Namii [9d\]: After M5, N8? ] (;W[om] ;B[kk]C[Tien [9d?\]: Oh, this should be fine to black no? Finnish8d [-\]: very fine ^^ Tien [9d?\]: White has to sacrifice, I think Finnish8d [-\]: yeah Namii [9d\]: hmm Finnish8d [-\]: but one sec ] ;W[jn]) (;W[kk] ;B[om] ;W[nm] ;B[nn]C[Tien [9d?\]: (well, it's still definitely better than the game) Finnish8d [-\]: then I think b may take this deal Tien [9d?\]: Alright :) Finnish8d [-\]: it is again a close deal, but I think b can take it ^^ Finnish8d [-\]: w that take is also very big Namii [9d\]: hmm Namii [9d\]: Is there something with Q9 and P10? Tien [9d?\]: There is, yes ] (;W[mn]C[Tien [9d?\]: Because the white centre got real solid ] ;B[mm] ;W[on] ;B[ml]C[Tien [9d?\]: Mainly, need to evaluate if the capture is worth it for black when white plays h6 ] ;W[nl] ;B[mk]C[Tien [9d?\]: I think we can call it dead Finnish8d [-\]: ok : ) ]) (;W[pk] ;B[qk] ;W[oj]C[Tien [9d?\]: Slightly annoying Finnish8d [-\]: ah this thing Tien [9d?\]: I guess black'd just defend and fight the ko Finnish8d [-\]: if so I prefer w instead :P Tien [9d?\]: Well, I think it's still a close call Finnish8d [-\]: ok Tien [9d?\]: Black turned his dame stones from the game to profit Tien [9d?\]: But ok, forward? ])))) (;W[qq] (;B[qr] ;W[pp] ;B[oq] ;W[rq]C[Tien [9d?\]: I think black'll push with q4 ]) (;B[pp]C[Namii [9d\]: Yeah ] ;W[qp] ;B[po] ;W[qn]C[Namii [9d\]: it looks good here ] ;B[pn]C[Namii [9d\]: Black is so thick ] (;W[gl]) (;W[gm]C[Tien [9d?\]: Yeah, something like that Namii [9d\]: I'm not sure if this is really bad for black Tien [9d?\]: Actually this white move becomes almost optimal Namii [9d\]: Hmm... In that way... Tien [9d?\]: Since now d7 dies naturally while the black moyo is shrunk ]) (;W[go]C[Finnish8d [-\]: hehe sorry, I am greedy :P Tien [9d?\]: It's not like the lower right is that bad for black, but it's not all too good either Tien [9d?\]: White still gets the big corner and sente Finnish8d [-\]: so thinking about better ^^ Finnish8d [-\]: but I am sure this prefers w Namii [9d\]: Ok, agreed :P Finnish8d [-\]: which one w should take here? Tien [9d?\]: Maybe this turn is good Finnish8d [-\]: ok : ) Tien [9d?\]: Black won't escape anyway Namii [9d\]: Black doesn't have a shape now Namii [9d\]: H5, but that's so awful Tien [9d?\]: Yeah, but no choice Finnish8d [-\]: alright ] ;B[ho] ;W[hn] ;B[io]C[Tien [9d?\]: Then like j8 or something :) ] (;W[il]C[Namii [9d\]: Jeff will like that :) Finnish8d [-\]: ah go further ^^ Finnish8d [-\]: alright Namii [9d\]: B may stop here and take Q18? Namii [9d\]: But yeah Tien [9d?\]: Yeah, that's biggest now Tien [9d?\]: Maybe white could go there instead of this? ]) (;W[qc]C[Namii [9d\]: Black is feeling the pressure Finnish8d [-\]: That was my instinct ^^ Tien [9d?\]: I'd have done this in the Gothenburg tournament for sure :D Finnish8d [-\]: ^^ Kettu [?\]: isn't lower center so so so big Kettu [?\]: and this gote Finnish8d [-\]: well Finnish8d [-\]: just because it is so big Finnish8d [-\]: so b cannot cover it with one move Tien [9d?\]: Same for white, kind of Finnish8d [-\]: centre territory is the hardest Mokki [3d\]: I feel there is a double threat move on the boar that is good Mokki [3d\]: like H9 for black Finnish8d [-\]: ah well Namii [9d\]: White will surely resist Namii [9d\]: Black J8 was my instnict Tien [9d?\]: Mine too Tien [9d?\]: But even then, it's not too big Namii [9d\]: Yeah Tien [9d?\]: Imagine white p10 or so for sabaki Mokki [3d\]: can we play the moves on board? Namii [9d\]: R17 is something immediate (big) profit ] (;B[hk] ;W[il]C[Tien [9d?\]: Or that ]) (;B[pc] ;W[pb]C[Kettu [?\]: but if b can then get the centre moves in sente, can return to top right later ] (;B[hk] ;W[il]C[Kettu [?\]: so why not play them Kettu [?\]: for example start with j8 Namii [9d\]: Hmm... will it be sente Mokki [3d\]: now what happens from B h7? Namii [9d\]: I would want to make sure it isn't :P Tien [9d?\]: Mokki, h8 ] ;B[hm]C[Kettu [?\]: in sente on border of two moyos? yes please! ] ;W[hl]C[Namii [9d\]: The mutual damage principle applies well here Namii [9d\]: White doesn't need to get his moyo if black doesn't get his either Namii [9d\]: And if black grows the moyo with less efficient moves, R17 is bigger in size Kettu [?\]: J8 clearly better than H9, no? Namii [9d\]: Right ]) (;B[il]C[Tien [9d?\]: I'll just play s18 ] ;W[rb]C[Kettu [?\]: but the center... so big... :O Namii [9d\]: Black still needs more moves to cover the center Tien [9d?\]: You still don't have just one good move :) Namii [9d\]: Well, you already have everything under M5 as points Namii [9d\]: so those moves you play there now only concern the area above that Namii [9d\]: and it's hard to seal Finnish8d [-\]: it is big if one move you get the value ^^ Namii [9d\]: k11 here? Namii [9d\]: =D Namii [9d\]: Nah, too thin Finnish8d [-\]: if you cannot get the value, no mater how big, it is not yours : ) Namii [9d\]: but something like M9 doesn't fully seal it Namii [9d\]: you can do Antti's P10 after that Kettu [?\]: i guess :) Finnish8d [-\]: that's why centre territory is normally not appreciated :P Tien [9d?\]: N14 or so, but still not perfect Namii [9d\]: R17 and S18 are big moves because they basically transfer black's points to white Tien [9d?\]: But ok, let's go on :) Finnish8d [-\]: right : ) ]))))))) (;B[ci]C[Namii [9d\]: White is happy to play C14 or something Mokki [3d\]: makes for a too weak group and white makes points? Tien [9d?\]: The group isn't exactly weak, I guess Tien [9d?\]: But it's not interesting enough Prodigious [3d?\]: black's group just is Tien [9d?\]: That group will not do anything useful apart from living Finnish8d [-\]: I'd guess this move is ok Namii [9d\]: Right. I judge Assu chose C14 because he felt a bit dissatisfied with a simple extension Finnish8d [-\]: but I won't do it myself ^^ Tien [9d?\]: Hehe Mokki [3d\]: ok ])) (;B[eq]C[Finnish8d [-\]: Yeah b should say thanks here ^^ Finnish8d [-\]: sure b should have said thanks here : ) Finnish8d [-\]: but b insisted on taking C7 Tien [9d?\]: Then for example go with the same Tien [9d?\]: Right ])) (;B[qp]C[Finnish8d [-\]: I'd kick here Namii [9d\]: R4 feels too urgent Prodigious [3d?\]: r4 demands to be played Finnish8d [-\]: again points plus tactical value Namii [9d\]: White would most likely R7 Tien [9d?\]: Oh, Assu didn't? ])) (;B[pd]BL[3579]C[Black: Ilya Shikshin White: Antti Törmänen] ;W[dc]WL[3594] ;B[qp]BL[3554] ;W[dq]WL[3553] ;B[oq]BL[3541] ;W[ce]WL[3523] ;B[co]BL[3378] ;W[nc]WL[3441]C[Tien [9d?\]: Hmm, this is mine ] ;B[qf]BL[3373] ;W[jd]WL[3358]C[Finnish8d [-\]: yeah sure Tien [9d?\]: Ah, ok, Prodi in too, nice Prodigious [3d?\]: yo Kettu [?\]: hi Finnish8d [-\]: hi ^^ Tien [9d?\]: Then maybe we should start with Prodi's after all? ] ;B[hq]BL[3217]C[Finnish8d [-\]: maybe I will give it back to Antti? Tien [9d?\]: Ok ] (;W[ep]WL[3292]C[Finnish8d [-\]: yup ] ;B[ck]BL[3215] ;W[cp]WL[3196] ;B[do]BL[3213] ;W[ci]WL[3129] ;B[fq]BL[3183]C[Tien [9d?\]: Yeah, e4 is an obvious one now ] ;W[eq]WL[2954] ;B[fn]BL[3180] (;W[go]WL[2905]C[Tien [9d?\]: And g5 too Finnish8d [-\]: right ^^ ] ;B[fo]BL[3176]C[Finnish8d [-\]: ^^ ] ;W[fp]WL[2900] ;B[gp]BL[3175] ;W[ho]WL[2886] ;B[jq]BL[3140] ;W[fr]WL[2828] ;B[ko]BL[3030] ;W[ej]WL[2723]LB[dl:A]C[Finnish8d [-\]: anything but that cut, I like it : ) Tien [9d?\]: Hehe Tien [9d?\]: And yeah, A instead was possibly interesting Tien [9d?\]: Aim for any thinness in black's shape ] (;B[gk]BL[3004]C[Tien [9d?\]: Ok, now this black move feels odd too ] ;W[el]WL[2652] ;B[fl]BL[2966] ;W[pk]WL[2494] ;B[qm]BL[2944] ;W[kq]WL[2437]C[Tien [9d?\]: Probe time here ] ;B[jp]BL[2729] ;W[ir]WL[2364] ;B[iq]BL[2727] ;W[nq]WL[2329] ;B[nr]BL[2720] ;W[or]WL[2312] ;B[np]BL[2653] ;W[mq]WL[2302] ;B[mr]BL[2653]C[Finnish8d [-\]: I mean, w has to action a bit earlier? ] (;W[ph]WL[2138] ;B[ol]BL[2596]C[Finnish8d [-\]: ^^ Tien [9d?\]: Hmm Finnish8d [-\]: no move around there it feels like Tien [9d?\]: Right, and doesn't have to be Tien [9d?\]: So then live on the lower side, for sure Finnish8d [-\]: right Finnish8d [-\]: biggest Finnish8d [-\]: but b will resist, it will be a chaos Tien [9d?\]: Yeah, I'm actually considering what way to start with Kettu [?\]: :) Tien [9d?\]: Just m2 doesn't cut it Finnish8d [-\]: still tough Tien [9d?\]: Black is way too solid alright Finnish8d [-\]: cannot do Q12? ] (;W[oe]WL[2044]C[Tien [9d?\]: Ok, it does feel odd ] ;B[pc]BL[2472] ;W[og]WL[1973] ;B[hc]BL[2467] ;W[ic]WL[1961] ;B[hd]BL[2465] ;W[if]WL[1953]C[Tien [9d?\]: So then h16 is also a big one Finnish8d [-\]: and thanks to H16 Tien [9d?\]: Since now white was able to catch up a lot ] ;B[ec]BL[2321]C[Finnish8d [-\]: right ] ;W[dd]WL[1860] ;B[db]BL[2291] ;W[cb]WL[1856] ;B[fb]BL[2205] ;W[da]WL[1841] ;B[gf]BL[2198] ;W[gj]WL[1785] ;B[hj]BL[2193] ;W[gi]WL[1781] ;B[ed]BL[2174] ;W[eb]WL[1714] ;B[ef]BL[2129] ;W[hk]WL[1682] ;B[ij]BL[2092] ;W[hl]WL[1514] ;B[em]BL[2075] ;W[jk]WL[1452] ;B[ik]BL[2069] ;W[il]WL[1418] ;B[jl]BL[2068] ;W[kk]WL[1371] ;B[ji]BL[2036] ;W[kn]WL[1259] ;B[jm]BL[1938] ;W[gm]WL[1222] ;B[ek]BL[1785] ;W[jn]WL[1213]C[Tien [9d?\]: Hmm, so some black mistake in the process here Finnish8d [-\]: so ok, like this, w is back to the game Finnish8d [-\]: not like my feeling during watching Finnish8d [-\]: that w wins here Tien [9d?\]: Alright Tien [9d?\]: Yeah, that feels more reasonable Tien [9d?\]: Black is still really solid all over Finnish8d [-\]: right ] ;B[ln]BL[1784] ;W[km]WL[1185] ;B[je]BL[1770] ;W[ie]WL[1167] ;B[id]BL[1769] (;W[jc]WL[1138] ;B[hh]BL[1714] ;W[jg]WL[1082] ;B[ke]BL[1709] ;W[lg]WL[963] ;B[ld]BL[1675] ;W[lc]WL[914] ;B[mc]BL[1669] ;W[lb]WL[832] ;B[nd]BL[1625] ;W[mb]WL[827] ;B[od]BL[1620] ;W[md]WL[822] ;B[me]BL[1615] ;W[gh]WL[781] ;B[hb]BL[1586] ;W[ob]WL[748] ;B[jb]BL[1582] ;W[hg]WL[570] ;B[ib]BL[1509] ;W[pb]WL[550] ;B[qb]BL[1508] ;W[na]WL[466] ;B[pa]BL[1497] ;W[kb]WL[460] (;B[bo]BL[1492]C[Tien [9d?\]: Another black mistake here, too small Finnish8d [-\]: right Tien [9d?\]: Got to be something on the lower side ] ;W[mp]WL[416] ;B[lr]BL[1489]C[Tien [9d?\]: And what was white's sequence again Finnish8d [-\]: have to read again :P Tien [9d?\]: I peeked :D ] (;W[pl]WL[327] ;B[pm]BL[1486] ;W[om]WL[312] ;B[ok]BL[1481] ;W[pj]WL[253] ;B[nm]BL[1467] ;W[on]WL[244] ;B[nn]BL[1466] ;W[op]WL[185] ;B[pq]BL[1463] ;W[no]WL[180] ;B[mo]BL[1449] ;W[nl]WL[61] ;B[pn]BL[1445] ;W[oo]WL[58] ;B[nk]BL[1410] ;W[ml]WL[54] ;B[mk]BL[1410] ;W[mj]WL[515] ;B[po]BL[1395] ;W[mm]WL[504] ;B[mn]BL[1394] ;W[lk]WL[493] ;B[pp]BL[1393] ;W[kc]WL[479] ;B[mc]BL[1391] ;W[qc]WL[467] ;B[rc]BL[1382] ;W[md]WL[462] ;B[bq]BL[1375] ;W[fa]WL[413] ;B[de]BL[1350] ;W[fe]WL[360] ;B[fd]BL[1332] ;W[gb]WL[322] ;B[gc]BL[1325] ;W[fc]WL[319] ;B[ge]BL[1323] ;W[df]WL[305] ;B[fb]BL[1321] ;W[np]WL[271] ;B[lq]BL[1318] ;W[fc]WL[267] ;B[ee]BL[1317] ;W[gq]WL[194] ;B[mc]BL[1287] ;W[qg]WL[142] ;B[hr]BL[1206] ;W[br]WL[113] ;B[fb]BL[1041] ;W[md]WL[93] ;B[ga]BL[1034] ;W[rf]WL[71] ;B[re]BL[1032] ;W[qe]WL[68] ;B[qd]BL[1031] ;W[rl]WL[61] ;B[mc]BL[1025] ;W[dg]WL[44] ;B[ql]BL[1018] ;W[rk]WL[41] ;B[qk]BL[996] ;W[qj]WL[38] ;B[mg]BL[940] ;W[mh]WL[24] ;B[lf]BL[932] ;W[kg]WL[18] ;B[pf]BL[908] ;W[of]WL[555] ;B[rg]BL[904] ;W[rh]WL[551] ;B[bj]BL[824] ;W[bi]WL[539] ;B[ai]BL[786] ;W[ah]WL[532] ;B[aj]BL[786] ;W[bg]WL[514] ;B[bp]BL[753] ;W[ar]WL[504] ;B[oc]BL[616] ;W[md]WL[483] ;B[cr]BL[615] ;W[cq]WL[477] ;B[mc]BL[614] ;W[lp]WL[454] ;B[kp]BL[611] ;W[md]WL[451] ;B[dr]BL[607] ;W[er]WL[431] ;B[mc]BL[606] ;W[dk]WL[329] ;B[dl]BL[594] ;W[md]WL[325] ;B[cd]BL[593]) (;W[op] ;B[pq]C[Finnish8d [-\]: P4 then N7 ] ;W[mm]C[Tien [9d?\]: Yeah ] ;B[mn] ;W[nm] ;B[nn] ;W[om]C[Tien [9d?\]: And with this, white is fine ] ;B[pl] ;W[on] ;B[no] ;W[oo] ;B[lo] ;W[qk]C[Tien [9d?\]: And something Finnish8d [-\]: this is enough? Tien [9d?\]: Not sure, but it has to be like this right? Finnish8d [-\]: right ] ;B[ok] ;W[mk] ;B[rh] ;W[qi] (;B[bq]LB[rn:A]C[Tien [9d?\]: I still feel like black is a bit good Finnish8d [-\]: yeah just what I want to say Finnish8d [-\]: what w got is limited from bottom in fact Tien [9d?\]: Ok, but really close when counting now Finnish8d [-\]: so b has a judgement here probably Tien [9d?\]: White has good endgame at around A, so it could be fine Finnish8d [-\]: that is w right ] ;W[gq] ;B[hr] ;W[rn] ;B[qn] ;W[ro] ;B[qo] ;W[ql] ;B[pm] ;W[rm] ;B[rp]C[Tien [9d?\]: Yeah, I think white is fine here Finnish8d [-\]: ok ]) (;B[rm] ;W[bp]C[Tien [9d?\]: Maybe this is more like it Finnish8d [-\]: yeah Tien [9d?\]: Still should be good enough to white Tien [9d?\]: Ok, maybe we can stop the actual live review now with this two hours? Finnish8d [-\]: sure ^^ Tien [9d?\]: I thought we could also make a cleaned-up version of this sgf file Finnish8d [-\]: so next Tuesday, 2nd round? Tien [9d?\]: With just the most important content, most of the comments removed Finnish8d [-\]: right Tien [9d?\]: And yeah, the next session is in one week Finnish8d [-\]: ok : ) Tien [9d?\]: I think we'll still need to try to get more actual discussion Tien [9d?\]: But it looks like these meetings could work out Finnish8d [-\]: yeah Tien [9d?\]: Kettu and Prodi, opinions? Namii [9d\]: ^^ Tien [9d?\]: I can make the cleaned-up file today Namii [9d\]: Rgr Tien [9d?\]: But we should maybe even-out that during the next weeks Tien [9d?\]: Ok, see you next time! Finnish8d [-\]: yeah sure Namii [9d\]: thanks all \\o Finnish8d [-\]: I will do it next time Finnish8d [-\]: thanks ^^ ]))) (;B[mm]C[Tien [9d?\]: Fix here or so? Finnish8d [-\]: yeah should be fine ])) (;W[ih]C[Tien [9d?\]: Is this still reasonable? Finnish8d [-\]: still this is reasonable, yes ] ;B[jc] ;W[kd] ;B[kc] ;W[ld] ;B[ok]C[Tien [9d?\]: Then go for lower side Finnish8d [-\]: yeah ])) (;W[mp]C[Tien [9d?\]: So turn I guess ] ;B[lr]C[Finnish8d [-\]: he will M2 Finnish8d [-\]: yeah Kettu [?\]: disaster? ] (;W[op] ;B[pq]) (;W[pr]C[Finnish8d [-\]: G5 is a big one Tien [9d?\]: Yeah, it does make everything difficult later on Finnish8d [-\]: now just nothing is easy ])) (;W[pr]C[Tien [9d?\]: Take the corner instead? Tien [9d?\]: Hmm, not simple either Finnish8d [-\]: so from today's view ])) (;W[mp] ;B[lr] ;W[pm]C[Finnish8d [-\]: yeah Tien [9d?\]: This'd be an idea then Namii [9d\]: Since w dosen't have to do P15-Q17 now, I like this Finnish8d [-\]: not now right ^^ Tien [9d?\]: Yeah ok, this is manageable, found it ])) (;B[fk]C[Tien [9d?\]: Isn't this the shape? Finnish8d [-\]: yeah it is ])) (;W[pk]C[Tien [9d?\]: And here, just take the right side for now Tien [9d?\]: Anything but that cut ])) (;W[cp]C[Finnish8d [-\]: you memorize it better than I do : ) ] ;B[do] ;W[fq] (;B[go] ;W[dj]C[Tien [9d?\]: So knowing Ilya, we'd probably get this ]) (;B[dj]C[Tien [9d?\]: Though actually something like this is probably better ]))) (;B[qd]BL[3559]C[Black: Timur Sankin White: Juuso NyyssönenFinnish8d [-\]: sure ] ;W[dp]WL[3598] ;B[pq]BL[3555]C[Tien [9d?\]: It's the next one I think ] ;W[dc]WL[3596] ;B[oc]BL[3526] ;W[po]WL[3590] ;B[pl]BL[3508] ;W[mp]WL[3525] ;B[oo]BL[3505] ;W[on]WL[3524]C[Tien [9d?\]: Ah, no ] ;B[no]BL[3503]C[Tien [9d?\]: The lowest one then :D ] ;W[pp]WL[3495] ;B[nq]BL[3495] ;W[qq]WL[3480] ;B[oq]BL[3493] ;W[nn]WL[3478] ;B[mo]BL[3492] ;W[rp]WL[3356] ;B[iq]BL[3438] ;W[pi]WL[3351] ;B[qg]BL[3429] ;W[qh]WL[3302] ;B[pg]BL[3365] ;W[ok]WL[3300]C[Tien [9d?\]: I guess so far there's nothing special Finnish8d [-\]: right ] ;B[de]BL[3358] ;W[cg]WL[3286]LB[ce:A]C[Finnish8d [-\]: right Tien [9d?\]: Like, if it was me, I'd pick A here Tien [9d?\]: But I cannot say c13 is worse ] ;B[be]BL[3231] (;W[fd]WL[3257]C[Tien [9d?\]: Yes, I'd do that too ] ;B[ef]BL[3227] ;W[cj]WL[3251]C[Tien [9d?\]: ...And now there's probably something odd ] ;B[hc]BL[3220]C[Tien [9d?\]: Welcome in, Mokki Tien [9d?\]: We started from Prodi's game ] ;W[hd]WL[3245] ;B[id]BL[3217] ;W[he]WL[3244] ;B[ec]BL[3169] ;W[eb]WL[3242] ;B[dd]BL[3086] ;W[ic]WL[3239] ;B[db]BL[3082] ;W[fb]WL[3238] ;B[cc]BL[3081] ;W[jc]WL[3237]TR[oc][qd][pg][qg]C[Finnish8d [-\]: very fine : ) Finnish8d [-\]: but Tien [9d?\]: If I remember right, this sequence is one of the joseki alright Finnish8d [-\]: I prefer b Tien [9d?\]: Right, for two reasons Tien [9d?\]: First, white's thick group is towards that incredibly solid black corner Tien [9d?\]: Secondly, black corner profit and sente Prodigious [3d?\]: yeah, black is ok Finnish8d [-\]: Was thinking during the game, that if w should have 2 space extension instead of F16 keima Tien [9d?\]: But right, maybe something a bit off for white, but didn't decide anything ] ;B[cl]BL[3040] ;W[cn]WL[3221] ;B[dk]BL[3023] ;W[dj]WL[3096] ;B[fk]BL[2960] ;W[ej]WL[2484] ;B[ek]BL[2858] ;W[gi]WL[2477] ;B[dr]BL[2837] ;W[cq]WL[2439] ;B[fq]BL[2390]C[Finnish8d [-\]: no idea how to manage this shape :P Tien [9d?\]: Right ] (;W[hp]WL[2427] ;B[fo]BL[2341]C[Tien [9d?\]: Hmm, I guess around here it went downhill for white Finnish8d [-\]: H4 asked a bit too much Prodigious [3d?\]: hehe, yeah Prodigious [3d?\]: i knew this was coming Tien [9d?\]: From looking at the whole game, this seems to be the most crucial part Tien [9d?\]: And alright, by this cut white has to be in trouble ] ;W[hq]WL[2425]C[Finnish8d [-\]: This is so difficult a situation ] ;B[ip]BL[2335]C[Finnish8d [-\]: to me at least b doesn't need to push from behind for the 2nd one ] ;W[ho]WL[2423] (;B[io]BL[1769] ;W[hn]WL[2407] ;B[en]BL[1743]C[Tien [9d?\]: Ok, so black was a bit slack at around here? Finnish8d [-\]: well ] ;W[cr]WL[2379] ;B[in]BL[1695] ;W[hl]WL[2274] ;B[gj]BL[1667] ;W[im]WL[2199] ;B[gm]BL[1654] ;W[hm]WL[2189] ;B[hi]BL[1641] ;W[gh]WL[2180] ;B[eh]BL[1579] ;W[fi]WL[2148] ;B[ij]BL[1541]LB[pl:B][ip:A]C[Tien [9d?\]: Hmm, ok, how's the situation Tien [9d?\]: Looks reasonable so far? Finnish8d [-\]: feels better now Finnish8d [-\]: when b let w get C2 Tien [9d?\]: Black A may have been bad Tien [9d?\]: But anyway, white still has to escape Prodigious [3d?\]: yeah, i got away pretty easy in the end Tien [9d?\]: And there's that stone at B lying in wait ] ;W[kl]WL[2112] ;B[mn]BL[1366]C[Tien [9d?\]: Huh Tien [9d?\]: Now white fixes for free? ] ;W[ol]WL[2066]C[Finnish8d [-\]: yeah Prodigious [3d?\]: more or less, yeah Tien [9d?\]: Then this should be a white clean lead now ] ;B[nm]BL[1359] ;W[om]WL[2056] ;B[hf]BL[1211]C[Finnish8d [-\]: right, w is good at this moment ] ;W[gf]WL[1876]C[Prodigious [3d?\]: sure ] ;B[lk]BL[679] ;W[kk]WL[1865] ;B[lj]BL[672] ;W[kj]WL[1857] ;B[ki]BL[671] ;W[ji]WL[1810] ;B[jh]BL[607] ;W[ml]WL[1777] ;B[li]BL[533] ;W[ll]WL[1772] ;B[hr]BL[299] ;W[gr]WL[1769] ;B[ir]BL[297] ;W[fr]WL[1756]C[Prodigious [3d?\]: i manage to mess up the upper right corner in a spectacular fashion though Tien [9d?\]: Wait, f2? Prodigious [3d?\]: yeah, bad Prodigious [3d?\]: should play on the top Finnish8d [-\]: too small Tien [9d?\]: Right, that's way bigger ] ;B[ig]BL[265] ;W[jj]WL[1633] ;B[hh]BL[251] ;W[gg]WL[1630] ;B[kc]BL[209]C[Tien [9d?\]: ...Russian style Finnish8d [-\]: :D ] (;W[jd]WL[1493]C[Kettu [?\]: ?! Prodigious [3d?\]: there are some annoying things here Finnish8d [-\]: ask for extreme ^^ ] ;B[kb]BL[199]C[Finnish8d [-\]: ^^ Tien [9d?\]: Hmm, 50 seconds for the next move Tien [9d?\]: Did you count? Prodigious [3d?\]: i don't remember Tien [9d?\]: Looks like an important moment Prodigious [3d?\]: i thought i was doing ok Finnish8d [-\]: top right area is the decisive area Tien [9d?\]: Ok, so look for aji ] ;W[pc]WL[1443] ;B[od]BL[141] ;W[qc]WL[1429] ;B[rd]BL[109] ;W[kg]WL[1389] ;B[kh]BL[81] ;W[lg]WL[1340] ;B[mh]BL[38] ;W[mc]WL[1284] ;B[ie]BL[584] ;W[je]WL[1181] ;B[if]BL[582] ;W[gd]WL[1131] ;B[mb]BL[534] ;W[nb]WL[1076] ;B[ob]BL[530]C[Prodigious [3d?\]: but here everything goes awry ] ;W[lb]WL[1074] ;B[lc]BL[456] ;W[nf]WL[932]C[Prodigious [3d?\]: after a really bad misread ] ;B[oh]BL[437] ;W[ma]WL[860] ;B[md]BL[434] ;W[ld]WL[851] ;B[kd]BL[364] ;W[le]WL[784] ;B[ke]BL[362] ;W[kf]WL[766] ;B[me]BL[338] ;W[lf]WL[764] ;B[nc]BL[328] ;W[mb]WL[761] ;B[hb]BL[309] (;W[ib]WL[752] ;B[ka]BL[251]C[Prodigious [3d?\]: l19 too good Tien [9d?\]: Yeah ok, that's big ] ;W[jf]WL[644] ;B[la]BL[229]C[Tien [9d?\]: Dang, that's tough ] ;W[ng]WL[515] ;B[oi]BL[226] ;W[rg]WL[467] ;B[rf]BL[222] ;W[rh]WL[466] ;B[pj]BL[218] ;W[qj]WL[465] ;B[kn]BL[214] ;W[pr]WL[343] ;B[qr]BL[210] ;W[rr]WL[335] ;B[ph]BL[198] ;W[qi]WL[331] ;B[pk]BL[197]C[Tien [9d?\]: Ok, I guess we've seen this now? Prodigious [3d?\]: sure ] ;W[oj]WL[325] ;B[rk]BL[194] ;W[qk]WL[310] ;B[ql]BL[192] ;W[rl]WL[310] ;B[rm]BL[189] ;W[sl]WL[310] ;B[sm]BL[185] ;W[qm]WL[310] ;B[sk]BL[599] ;W[rl]WL[310] ;B[sl]BL[598] ;W[pm]WL[310] ;B[rl]BL[598] ;W[rj]WL[310] ;B[si]BL[537] ;W[rn]WL[231] ;B[sg]BL[524] ;W[sh]WL[226] ;B[sf]BL[493] ;W[sn]WL[224]C[Prodigious [3d?\]: he gives me some points for free here Prodigious [3d?\]: but not enough Finnish8d [-\]: top side is decisive, after that nothing much Tien [9d?\]: Ok Tien [9d?\]: Let's go for Assu's then? ] ;B[eq]BL[467] ;W[er]WL[198] ;B[dq]BL[464] ;W[ds]WL[190] ;B[bm]BL[376] ;W[do]WL[163] ;B[fp]BL[331] ;W[bn]WL[160] ;B[bh]BL[318] ;W[dg]WL[23] ;B[bk]BL[281] ;W[bg]WL[1] ;B[bj]BL[277] ;W[eg]WL[587] ;B[or]BL[272] ;W[qs]WL[511] ;B[an]BL[256] ;W[ao]WL[507] ;B[am]BL[255] ;W[bp]WL[500] ;B[gq]BL[210] ;W[dm]WL[472] ;B[em]BL[202] ;W[of]WL[397] ;B[pf]BL[194] ;W[oe]WL[388] ;B[pe]BL[185] ;W[ci]WL[370] ;B[gs]BL[181] ;W[es]WL[369] ;B[bi]BL[128] ;W[af]WL[282] ;B[ae]BL[122] ;W[mm]WL[242] ;B[jm]BL[102] ;W[jl]WL[235] ;B[ik]BL[98] ;W[km]WL[234] ;B[jn]BL[594] ;W[il]WL[233] ;B[fc]BL[445] ;W[gc]WL[230] ;B[ea]BL[428] ;W[fa]WL[221] ;B[da]BL[425] ;W[ed]WL[220] ;B[dc]BL[424] ;W[ha]WL[214] ;B[ff]BL[413] ;W[ln]WL[190] ;B[lo]BL[411] ;W[df]WL[153] ;B[ee]BL[402] ;W[ce]WL[145] ;B[cd]BL[376] ;W[bf]WL[141] ;B[bc]BL[361] ;W[gl]WL[98] ;B[fl]BL[326] ;W[gn]WL[71] ;B[fe]BL[310] ;W[ge]WL[70] ;B[fg]BL[304] ;W[fh]WL[597] ;B[ch]BL[301] ;W[dh]WL[595] ;B[fm]BL[260] ;W[ii]WL[541] ;B[dn]BL[229] ;W[cm]WL[536] ;B[dl]BL[227] ;W[ih]WL[522] ;B[hj]BL[216] ;W[ne]WL[483] ;B[nd]BL[158] ;W[nj]WL[453] ;B[mi]BL[154] ;W[op]WL[443] ;B[np]BL[153] ;W[mk]WL[384] ;B[os]BL[150] ;W[ps]WL[361] ;B[na]BL[101] ;W[ah]WL[355] ;B[ai]BL[99] ;W[cf]WL[321] ;B[ag]BL[93] ;W[ei]WL[321] ;B[ah]BL[595] ;W[lm]WL[317] ;B[eo]BL[589] ;W[co]WL[315] ;B[hg]BL[585] ;W[cs]WL[292] ;B[hs]BL[582] ;W[gb]WL[283] ;B[jg]BL[576] ;W[jb]WL[278] ;B[ja]BL[575] ;W[]WL[274] ;B[]BL[571] ;W[]WL[274] ;TW[ga][hb][hc][eh][di][ri][si][pj][sj][nk][pk][rk][sk][nl][pl][ql][rl][sl][nm][rm][sm][pn][qn][bo][qo][ro][so][ap][cp][qp][sp][aq][bq][rq][sq][ar][br][qr][sr][as][bs][rs][ss]TB[aa][ba][ca][ma][oa][pa][qa][ra][sa][ab][bb][cb][lb][mb][nb][pb][qb][rb][sb][ac][mc][pc][qc][rc][sc][ad][bd][pd][sd][qe][re][se][qf][aj][ak][al][bl][el][jo][ko][jp][kp][lp][mp][jq][kq][lq][mq][jr][kr][lr][mr][nr][is][js][ks][ls][ms][ns]OS[Arctic][Cadet354][Ckilo][Darchik][Djazman187][Ergo2012][Fede][FreshMint][Gardan][Hensch][Iceape][Igorin][JeffChang][Juippi][Kettu][Kyumato][Laman][Landa][Lebertran][Lepakko][LucianC][Lukan][M15][Mikgo][NMPC][Nighthawk][Nilatarion][Nimerib][Oni][PPP33333][Palko][Pugovka][Roln][Skeletor][SuRin][Wade][ayano][baldur][basilika][betterlife][canaima][doctor][edikar][egorars][han00101][hegethus][hvk][jnalanko][kallekalle][lazer][lolita][mdcl][otom][punactpy][redtealeaf][sawara123][slowgo][tsunamigo][tudorus][uncle7][valius][wano]) (;W[ka] ;B[fc]C[Tien [9d?\]: So if white defends now, he's fine? Prodigious [3d?\]: hopefully ] ;W[dh]C[Tien [9d?\]: Something like this Namii [9d\]: Hi there Finnish8d [-\]: hi ^^ Tien [9d?\]: Hi Tien [9d?\]: Still seems close Tien [9d?\]: but yeah, should be white's lead Prodigious [3d?\]: i saw l19 immediately after i played j18 Tien [9d?\]: ...If white can live without paying anything, that is Prodigious [3d?\]: feels bad man ])) (;W[kb] ;B[lb]C[Tien [9d?\]: This way, huh? Finnish8d [-\]: to me b is not wrong actually Finnish8d [-\]: at least not wrong Finnish8d [-\]: just extreme Tien [9d?\]: I'd almost want to exchange now, but it seems a bit risky with the white on the left :) ])) (;B[cr]C[Finnish8d [-\]: if the 1st one may be ok Kettu [?\]: i think all of the pushes feel a bit bad for black Tien [9d?\]: This'd feel better alright Kettu [?\]: J6 also ] ;W[br]C[Finnish8d [-\]: definitely b should have attacked bottom left first no matter what ] ;B[bp]C[Prodigious [3d?\]: yeah, letting me get c2 was very generous Finnish8d [-\]: from this sense, J4 is also wrong Tien [9d?\]: Hehe Tien [9d?\]: See whatever happens here Tien [9d?\]: Ok, so we got lucky in this part :) ])) (;W[cr]C[Tien [9d?\]: Isn't it enough to defend? Finnish8d [-\]: that is an option ^^ Finnish8d [-\]: I may do F6 ] ;B[fo] ;W[mc]LB[qj:A][ol:C][mn:B]C[Tien [9d?\]: My vision was just like this Finnish8d [-\]: yeah, the thing is, I feel like F5 has both points value and tactical value Tien [9d?\]: Mokki and Kettu, you may give opinions and comments too :) Tien [9d?\]: And questions Mokki [3d\]: who is leading on points? Tien [9d?\]: That'd depend on the assessment of the right-side area Mokki [3d\]: i feel like b N6 here makes for too much territory Kettu [?\]: naturally :) i'm currently eating Finnish8d [-\]: yeah A is a question I worry about Prodigious [3d?\]: there's some aji on the right side, yea Tien [9d?\]: Right now, if black plays A, we cannot say for sure if white may kill black Prodigious [3d?\]: i want to play p8 pretty soon Tien [9d?\]: But if we imagine the exchange of black B for white C, then I think the right side is white's ] (;B[mn] ;W[ol] ;B[jm]C[Tien [9d?\]: So as to cover Mokki's concern about the lower side, we can calculate this out Tien [9d?\]: Upper right black, 20 Tien [9d?\]: Upper left black, 13 or so Tien [9d?\]: Lower side black, about 40? Finnish8d [-\]: yeah Tien [9d?\]: White left 5, lower left 12, upper side 16, right side a bit over 30 Tien [9d?\]: Ok, we've got white down by 5, but it's white's turn Tien [9d?\]: If like this, white shouldn't be bad Finnish8d [-\]: still a game Tien [9d?\]: But I think black n6 is a bit slack ]) (;B[qj]C[Tien [9d?\]: This'd be the real concern ])) (;W[fn] ;B[hk]C[Tien [9d?\]: Ok, so as to force black here Finnish8d [-\]: then F4 and tenuki ] ;W[fp] ;B[gq]LB[jp:A]C[Tien [9d?\]: But yeah, Jeff's comment about tactical value was good Tien [9d?\]: White has less corner territory this way, but black's left-side group isn't not strictly alive either Tien [9d?\]: Later, white may reduce at around A quite easily ] ;W[mc]C[Tien [9d?\]: Ok, balanced option ])) (;W[gc]C[Prodigious [3d?\]: ah yeah, possible Prodigious [3d?\]: i just kind of played f16 without thinking Tien [9d?\]: Since there's nothing too interesting along the upper side Tien [9d?\]: Right, since it's the standard one :) Finnish8d [-\]: ^^ Prodigious [3d?\]: this does seem to make more sense here Tien [9d?\]: I guess other than this, the rest is fine Tien [9d?\]: Should we predict a bit how this will go? Finnish8d [-\]: sure Finnish8d [-\]: so b will pincer I think ] ;B[ci]LB[bc:A][jc:B]C[Finnish8d [-\]: and it depends on w attitude : ) Finnish8d [-\]: people so modest like Prodi, won't fight here immediately I believe ^^ Tien [9d?\]: Hmm, let's see Finnish8d [-\]: then tenuki Tien [9d?\]: I wouldn't fight either Tien [9d?\]: And A and B feel miai enough Tien [9d?\]: So it's the lower left corner, right? Finnish8d [-\]: yeah sure ] ;W[cn]C[Tien [9d?\]: And then it's this side Finnish8d [-\]: no doubt, wider side ^^ Tien [9d?\]: And yeah, well, now it's a normal, boring game :) Finnish8d [-\]: :D Tien [9d?\]: Black'll take d2 or so next ])) (;B[qd]BL[3574]C[Black: Juri Kuronen White: Alexander Dinerchtein] ;W[qq]WL[3570]C[Tien [9d?\]: Yeah ] ;B[dc]BL[3436] ;W[cp]WL[3558] ;B[ce]BL[3356] ;W[od]WL[3506] ;B[oc]BL[3327] ;W[nc]WL[3478] ;B[pc]BL[3326] ;W[md]WL[3442] ;B[qf]BL[3287] ;W[jc]WL[3413] ;B[eq]BL[3120] ;W[cm]WL[3290] ;B[pn]BL[2863] ;W[nq]WL[3272] ;B[hc]BL[2678]C[Namii [9d\]: I had a special plan in this game Namii [9d\]: That explains some of the speedy decisions Tien [9d?\]: Hehe Finnish8d [-\]: In fact when I see it now, Q6 looks a bit odd Namii [9d\]: I knew that Dinerchtein will not easily attack you, so I took aadvantage of it Tien [9d?\]: I'd still prefer black o3 instead of q6 though :) Namii [9d\]: Right ^^ Finnish8d [-\]: just what I want to say ^^ ] ;W[dq]WL[3238] ;B[ep]BL[2662] ;W[gp]WL[3104] ;B[em]BL[2503] ;W[pk]WL[2992] ;B[co]BL[2451]C[Namii [9d\]: This was probably too early Namii [9d\]: Since C9 and so on lost effectiveness Finnish8d [-\]: I guess next time before we do this session, I shouldn't read pro games that day :P Tien [9d?\]: :D Namii [9d\]: In these kind of things I am weak at online games Namii [9d\]: Too hasty to play ] ;W[bo]WL[2990] ;B[do]BL[2450] (;W[bn]WL[2762] ;B[cq]BL[2309] ;W[cr]WL[2748] ;B[bq]BL[2307] ;W[dr]WL[2573] ;B[dp]BL[2301] ;W[bp]WL[2568] ;B[er]BL[2300] ;W[br]WL[2566] ;B[hq]BL[2299]C[Finnish8d [-\]: So already easy to b here, right? Namii [9d\]: I didn't mind it ^^ ] ;W[nn]WL[2382] ;B[ol]BL[2086] ;W[ok]WL[2370] ;B[nm]BL[2082] ;W[mm]WL[2359] ;B[nl]BL[2081] ;W[jq]WL[2173] (;B[nk]BL[1234] ;W[nj]WL[2012]C[Namii [9d\]: High quality internet gaems Finnish8d [-\]: so thanks to him then ^^ Tien [9d?\]: Hehe ] ;B[mj]BL[1210] ;W[ni]WL[1873] ;B[mn]BL[1191]C[Finnish8d [-\]: I know Finnish8d [-\]: I am thinking if w may resist this Finnish8d [-\]: cos otherwise too good to b ] (;W[no]WL[1808] ;B[lm]BL[1154]C[Namii [9d\]: I didn't feel bad here because I became quite thick in the center ] ;W[mi]WL[1762] ;B[lj]BL[927] ;W[mo]WL[1725]C[Tien [9d?\]: Ok, so massive black lead by now ] ;B[ln]BL[922] ;W[jo]WL[1414]C[Namii [9d\]: By the way, these reviews are supposed to be for Finnsih players, btu since we review in English, we are actually helping everyone :P Namii [9d\]: Unnationalistic! Tien [9d?\]: We need to hide the files so that foreigners won't easily find them :) Kettu [?\]: maybe run the sgf file through a google translate :)= Namii [9d\]: :D Tien [9d?\]: Haha Namii [9d\]: Yeah I felt satisfied here ] ;B[li]BL[740]TR[li][mi]C[Finnish8d [-\]: yeah actually wanted to ask earlier Namii [9d\]: Right. Namii [9d\]: I was still aiming at M17 Tien [9d?\]: M17 is no weakness, right? Namii [9d\]: that's why I thought M11 was a powerful turn Tien [9d?\]: It's too easy for white to answer n18 Finnish8d [-\]: those moves are both doing something actually pointless Namii [9d\]: Hehe Namii [9d\]: It's good to look at the game with fresh eyes :) Finnish8d [-\]: yeah Finnish8d [-\]: right after the game, we cannot see things clearly ] ;W[di]WL[1170] ;B[pi]BL[573] ;W[qi]WL[1104]C[Tien [9d?\]: Oh, yeah, that could be good Namii [9d\]: Then I could choose Q12 Namii [9d\]: W would not capture the 1 stone there Namii [9d\]: So I'd get what I want Namii [9d\]: Both made mistakes, I guess ] ;B[qj]BL[477] ;W[pj]WL[1092] ;B[ri]BL[474] ;W[qh]WL[1082]C[Tien [9d?\]: Truth be told, now that I see this, I don't like m11 very much ] (;B[ph]BL[473]C[Namii [9d\]: At least once ] (;W[pm]WL[974]C[Namii [9d\]: Q7 ended up being a pseudo tesuji Namii [9d\]: Since there is nothing in the corner black can do Namii [9d\]: my problem probably is that I play 90% moves like M11 instead of 100% moves Namii [9d\]: But anyway, I got all I wanted here because of this pseudo tesuji :D Tien [9d?\]: Anyway, another "thanks to breakfast" move here Tien [9d?\]: Yeah Namii [9d\]: Usually Dinerchtein is quite careful about points Finnish8d [-\]: and just in those few you may lose to European top ones Namii [9d\]: So this was weird Mokki [3d\]: thank you move :) Namii [9d\]: Maybe he overestimated the aji of the two stones Finnish8d [-\]: yeah, thanks to this ^^ Namii [9d\]: There is a ko, but a hard one Tien [9d?\]: That ko is basically like black owing maybe 2-3 points ] ;B[qk]BL[583] ;W[pl]WL[965]C[Namii [9d\]: White should play R9 and S9 first Namii [9d\]: Then Q7 ] ;B[rm]BL[583] ;W[qn]WL[699] ;B[rn]BL[478] ;W[qo]WL[624] ;B[hp]BL[264]C[Tien [9d?\]: I recall there were two more important areas Finnish8d [-\]: this is already not possible to lose Tien [9d?\]: The upper left corner and then around white h5 Finnish8d [-\]: ok Namii [9d\]: Yeah Finnish8d [-\]: let's see ] ;W[rh]WL[609] ;B[qg]BL[263] ;W[rj]WL[604] ;B[rk]BL[263] ;W[si]WL[601] ;B[sg]BL[262] ;W[sk]WL[512] ;B[rl]BL[259] ;W[fc]WL[392] ;B[he]BL[217]C[Namii [9d\]: Around here I am running terribly low on time ] ;W[hb]WL[256]C[Namii [9d\]: so I played normal moves ] ;B[ib]BL[152] ;W[ic]WL[234] ;B[gb]BL[151] ;W[hd]WL[233] ;B[gc]BL[150] ;W[gd]WL[232] ;B[fb]BL[149] ;W[ho]WL[65]C[Namii [9d\]: but I think this is good for black Namii [9d\]: Only, I should cut at G5 now Namii [9d\]: then do J16 if I have the time Tien [9d?\]: Yeah, that's simple Tien [9d?\]: Then it's done Finnish8d [-\]: yeah Namii [9d\]: G5 is very important Namii [9d\]: but... my time was very short ] ;B[id]BL[132] ;W[ge]WL[3] ;B[ie]BL[90] ;W[gf]WL[559] ;B[lc]BL[88] ;W[ld]WL[504] ;B[ig]BL[56] ;W[kc]WL[461]C[Namii [9d\]: This move (M17) is to get two moves in a row int he center Namii [9d\]: the center* Finnish8d [-\]: So M17 is a gift Finnish8d [-\]: ok ] ;B[gh]BL[54] ;W[df]WL[405] ;B[bg]BL[47]C[Namii [9d\]: Practical method ] ;W[en]WL[264]C[Namii [9d\]: Another thank you move :P Finnish8d [-\]: Yeah I do remember this one Tien [9d?\]: Then wrong white direction Finnish8d [-\]: thanks a lot to this ] ;B[fn]BL[37] ;W[fo]WL[235] ;B[gn]BL[37] ;W[gq]WL[190] ;B[go]BL[30] ;W[hr]WL[185]C[Finnish8d [-\]: hehe ok Namii [9d\]: It's more important to harass the white G14 group Namii [9d\]: but luckily, he made another thank you move :P ] ;B[hn]BL[29] ;W[dn]WL[131] ;B[fp]BL[26] ;W[fr]WL[125] ;B[eo]BL[24]C[Namii [9d\]: so I lost the sente ] ;W[fj]WL[92]C[Namii [9d\]: but H6 was bad Namii [9d\]: I am in time problems Namii [9d\]: or well, I think black is good anyway ] ;B[ei]BL[423] ;W[ej]WL[76]C[Namii [9d\]: F10 is just way too thin ] ;B[dh]BL[423] ;W[fi]WL[61]C[Tien [9d?\]: In any case, yes Namii [9d\]: Asks to be cut Tien [9d?\]: It got closer now, but black should be solid anyway ] ;B[fh]BL[419] ;W[eh]WL[60] ;B[eg]BL[418] ;W[dg]WL[34] ;B[ch]BL[417] ;W[fg]WL[32] ;B[ei]BL[417] ;W[rg]WL[28] ;B[rf]BL[416] ;W[eh]WL[28] ;B[ro]BL[275] ;W[ef]WL[25] ;B[qp]BL[274] ;W[pp]WL[23] ;B[rp]BL[274] ;W[pq]WL[16] ;B[hj]BL[258]C[Tien [9d?\]: Though j5 at around here would be better, likely Finnish8d [-\]: yeah J5 is huge Namii [9d\]: I wanted to fix the shape for my center stones Namii [9d\]: but yeah, J5 is big ] ;W[cd]WL[15] ;B[dd]BL[233] ;W[be]WL[13] ;B[bf]BL[231]C[Namii [9d\]: Now I manage to give white a small lead ] ;W[de]WL[11] ;B[cf]BL[230] ;W[cc]WL[10] ;B[cb]BL[229] ;W[bb]WL[599]C[Tien [9d?\]: Oh right and here, black had to give a bit away ] ;B[db]BL[227] ;W[bd]WL[586]C[Tien [9d?\]: It was b16 instead of d16 ] ;B[ac]BL[221] ;W[ab]WL[523] ;B[cj]BL[102]C[Namii [9d\]: Right. You mentioned it in your blog ] ;W[ba]WL[507] ;B[dk]BL[101] ;W[bk]WL[485] ;B[bj]BL[94]C[Tien [9d?\]: Oh right, I actually posted the commentary of this game there Namii [9d\]: Yeah. I think everything after this is included in your commentary ^^ Namii [9d\]: But the content in the opening was new Namii [9d\]: so maybe move to your game? Tien [9d?\]: Yeah Namii [9d\]: Now it's byo-yomi paradise for both Finnish8d [-\]: this price is inevitable it seems, from today's view Finnish8d [-\]: b corner is thin Finnish8d [-\]: ah ok Finnish8d [-\]: so move to Antti's? Namii [9d\]: White has a small lead for a while but then misreads at the top Tien [9d?\]: Yeah, that should be fine Finnish8d [-\]: ok : ) ] ;W[ck]WL[444] ;B[dj]BL[90] ;W[hh]WL[436] ;B[hg]BL[82] ;W[fl]WL[401] ;B[ek]BL[29] ;W[fk]WL[323] ;B[dm]BL[28] ;W[gi]WL[259] ;B[ae]BL[9] ;W[af]WL[254] ;B[ih]BL[448] ;W[cn]WL[245] ;B[fm]BL[439] ;W[gg]WL[232] ;B[io]BL[400] ;W[jn]WL[212] ;B[kp]BL[301] ;W[jp]WL[210] ;B[ag]BL[266] ;W[bc]WL[208] ;B[im]BL[248] ;W[jm]WL[205] ;B[jl]BL[247] ;W[kl]WL[201] ;B[jk]BL[246] ;W[hl]WL[188] ;B[hk]BL[236] ;W[gl]WL[168] ;B[il]BL[235] ;W[ll]WL[145] ;B[ml]BL[233] ;W[rq]WL[119] ;B[lo]BL[229] ;W[lp]WL[104] ;B[ir]BL[202] ;W[jr]WL[50] ;B[hs]BL[201] ;W[nb]WL[22] ;B[ob]BL[112] ;W[km]WL[468] ;B[ne]BL[102] ;W[oe]WL[440] ;B[nf]BL[79] ;W[og]WL[386] ;B[pg]BL[68] ;W[of]WL[384] ;B[lg]BL[48] ;W[mg]WL[344] ;B[lq]BL[23] ;W[mp]WL[340] ;B[js]BL[17] ;W[ks]WL[265] ;B[lb]BL[15] ;W[jb]WL[245] ;B[ha]BL[12] ;W[ke]WL[230] ;B[lf]BL[8] ;W[mf]WL[220] ;B[gr]BL[6] ;W[sp]WL[173] ;B[oi]BL[567] ;W[oj]WL[156] ;B[me]BL[551] ;W[le]WL[150] ;B[mh]BL[549] ;W[ng]WL[144] ;B[nh]BL[548] ;W[oh]WL[109] ;B[lh]BL[544] ;W[qm]WL[86] ;B[la]BL[540] ;W[ka]WL[67] ;B[na]BL[538] ;W[ia]WL[64] ;B[hb]BL[319] ;W[fd]WL[29] ;B[ec]BL[302] ;W[so]WL[25] ;B[sf]BL[290] ;W[sh]WL[24] ;B[sl]BL[286] ;W[sn]WL[23] ;B[sj]BL[285] ;W[nd]WL[22] ;B[ne]BL[283] ;W[sk]WL[21] ;B[sq]BL[277] ;W[sr]WL[18] ;B[sj]BL[277] ;W[ma]WL[595] ;B[mb]BL[275] ;W[sk]WL[594] ;B[kr]BL[262] ;W[kq]WL[540] ;B[sj]BL[259] ;W[ca]WL[526] ;B[da]BL[255] ;W[sk]WL[524] ;B[ls]BL[253] ;W[mr]WL[518] ;B[sj]BL[252] ;W[ed]WL[512] ;B[fa]BL[246] ;W[sk]WL[511] ;B[lr]BL[234] ;W[om]WL[496] ;B[sj]BL[228] ;W[eb]WL[492] ;B[ea]BL[227] ;W[sk]WL[492] ;B[mk]BL[549] ;W[ko]WL[490] ;B[sj]BL[549] ;W[hi]WL[455] ;B[ri]BL[525] ;W[ii]WL[453] ;B[jh]BL[483] ;W[hf]WL[406] ;B[if]BL[481] ;W[jd]WL[398] ;B[je]BL[479]) (;W[qk] ;B[rj] ;W[rk] ;B[rh] ;W[pm]C[Namii [9d\]: At most some moves at N12 will be sente Finnish8d [-\]: yeah of course Tien [9d?\]: Hmm, so what was black supposed to do? Tien [9d?\]: This looks like black made a mistake Finnish8d [-\]: thanks for reminding, I forgot our last discussion already :P Namii [9d\]: Maybe I should play at R9 instead of Q12 ])) (;B[qk]C[Tien [9d?\]: I'd prefer the left side Finnish8d [-\]: yeah this push Tien [9d?\]: But yeah, I guess this is fine Namii [9d\]: This seems more like suji ])) (;W[on]C[Namii [9d\]: Q8 ] ;B[pl] ;W[lm] (;B[qk]C[Tien [9d?\]: q5 or so ]) (;B[po]C[Finnish8d [-\]: yeah this is big Finnish8d [-\]: so ok Finnish8d [-\]: still w shape is bad ]))) (;B[hp]C[Tien [9d?\]: O9 looks like wrong direction alright Tien [9d?\]: And yeah, h4 looks good Finnish8d [-\]: hehe well, I stop here just because this is so big Namii [9d\]: Yeah, I wonder why I didn't play it. I guess I wanted to be extra active in the actual game Tien [9d?\]: This also capitalizes on Dinerchtein's weakness :) Finnish8d [-\]: and w doesn't know how to attack b right side anyway Namii [9d\]: Well finally w didn't continue with H4 either :D Tien [9d?\]: True that, which is also odd :) Finnish8d [-\]: hehe ok ])) (;W[bp]C[Tien [9d?\]: More like it, I g uess Finnish8d [-\]: right ])))