(;GM[1]FF[4]CA[UTF-8]AP[CGoban:3]ST[2]
RU[Japanese]SZ[19]KM[6.50]
PW[Juri Kuronen]PB[Antti Törmänen]WR[5d]BR[6d]DT[2012-12-29]EV[Finnish Championship Final]RO[1]C[FinFinal [?\]: Olisiko kellään EuroGoTV-FI:n salasanaa ustreamiin?
FinFinal [?\]: Juri saapui, kohta nigiir
FinFinal [?\]: Kamerajärjestely ei näköjään toimi, joten se jää tänä vuonna väliin
FinFinal [?\]: Peli starttaa oletettavasti 11:20 tai niillä main
]
;B[qd]
;W[cd]
;B[oc]
;W[qo]
;B[pq]C[snowman [-\]: 150 years old fuseki
Gardan [?\]: antti on siis päässyt opiskelussaan jo niin pitkälle
Ootakamoku [?\]: kummasta suunnasta se lähti liikkeelle opiskelussa?
snowman [-\]: tosi kummasta...
]
;W[dp]
;B[qk]
;W[op]
;B[oq]
;W[np]C[dxxd [2k\]: veikkaan et tää päättyy 2,5 pisteen eroon
]
;B[mq]C[Ootakamoku [?\]: voiko valkonen tenukoida tässä kohtaa topleftiin?
FinFinal [?\]: seems like w next move R3 is the must
Ootakamoku [?\]: vai jääkö noi bottom right stemut liian heikoiks?
]
;W[qq]
;B[ed]C[dxxd [2k\]: jaha, jännä tenuki
FinFinal [?\]: b tenuki is quite interesting. : )
dxxd [2k\]: r2 on iso
]
;W[nq]
;B[nr]
;W[mr]
;B[lr]
;W[or]
;B[ms]C[Ootakamoku [?\]: I dont see how w can be happy with this
]
;W[pr]C[FinFinal [?\]: w solid territory, but b mainly concerns about speed in the opening.
FinFinal [?\]: the only problem is R9's position I think, since w bottom right corner is pretty strong.
Ootakamoku [?\]: would it be too weird for b to play something like k16, instead of say.. c17? 
dxxd [2k\]: d14 a bit irritating for w but so is the next move at the bottom for b as well
FinFinal [?\]: as I know about Antti, he won't do C17, but impossible to be K16 either. :P
snowman [-\]: i expect something grand
FinFinal [?\]: d14 is natural for b next
Ootakamoku [?\]: d14 is good even with r9 weak?
Wirtuoosi [2d\]: not sure if d14 is consistent with having low stone at p17 though, maybe extend from ponnuki?
]
;B[df]C[FinFinal [?\]: hehe, I know him more after all :P
FinFinal [?\]: however, Oota's question is still valid. b this design is ambitious but risky, sure.
Ootakamoku [?\]: what time settings do they have?
FinFinal [?\]: 90 minutes main, plus 1 minute byoyomi
FinFinal [?\]: for now b 82 minutes, w 71 minutes left
FinFinal [?\]: I may directly go R11 if i were w
]
;W[cf]C[dxxd [2k\]: too bad attacking m2 group doesn't seem that effective, for example sequence starting from l3 seems lame atm
]
;B[dg]
;W[cg]
;B[dh]C[Ootakamoku [?\]: dxxd, w f3 is pretty strong against that black group, and nice I think.
Ootakamoku [?\]: but not excacly the most urgent move
Wirtuoosi [2d\]: seems Antti chose simple way to play here d13
Ootakamoku [?\]: wirtuoosi, the ladder breakers on the bottom side too much a burden if play hane instead of d13?
FinFinal [?\]: to me w made choice on top left corner too early
FinFinal [?\]: now b formation is strong
]
;W[kd]C[Wirtuoosi [2d\]: Ootakamoku, if I read correctly, o4 group already breaks the ladder
Werfeus [5d\]: pitäiskö tapahtumaistaa tämä?
Ootakamoku [?\]: oh.. I thought it hits the ponnuki, doh
]
;B[ch]C[snowman [-\]: L16 is like a white dwarf in black space
Wirtuoosi [2d\]: dwarves can be dangerous with their axes
dxxd [2k\]: now it looks good for b, w needs another move at the top to make l16 valid at all
FinFinal [?\]: l16 was surely questionable, however b this turn is also kinda slow
FinFinal [?\]: after b this turn, in the future it just makes b choice at bottom left harder.
Ootakamoku [?\]: this weakens l16 a bit? since now b has forcing moves in topleft..
FinFinal [?\]: sure, however it's w move next
Ootakamoku [?\]: hard to find a move for white tho.. dont want to ruin r11, dont want to play close to e16 since its already so very strong, topright corner solid..
Wirtuoosi [2d\]: those forcing moves also make w top left corner very low, not much points there and b will be very thick, so even if w spends move reinforcing l16, he doesn't have that much potential
]
;W[cn]C[Ootakamoku [?\]: b take the forcing moves in topleft, and then urm.. l14? m15? what?
Wirtuoosi [2d\]: I was thinking j17 after them as follow up, make points and prevent w from making base
Ootakamoku [?\]: wouldnt b j17 make c12 look bad?
Wirtuoosi [2d\]: but lower side looks urgent to me now
FinFinal [?\]: if I were b I'd C17 and nobi first, then J16 to attack
FinFinal [?\]: so automatically fix R11 from this attacking
Wirtuoosi [2d\]: sounds valid to me, my thinking is probably too territorial at the moment
FinFinal [?\]: hehe, but I have no idea how players will decide. already a few surprising decisions
]
;B[id]C[Wirtuoosi [2d\]: j17 would allow w to j16 so j16 for b looks better
FinFinal [?\]: mainly, high position to attack. : )
Ootakamoku [?\]: seems like alot of the value from c12 is the forcing moves in topleft to get thickness, but if extend to j16 then the forcing moves in topleft only have territorial value.. hence dont get c12
FinFinal [?\]: so b doesn't wanna exchange on top left, I'd guess b wanna reserve the possibility for attach C17 then double hane.
snowman [-\]: antti wants to kill the corner later :)
Wirtuoosi [2d\]: I guess I just thought w makes base too easily with j17 attachment
Ootakamoku [?\]: oh, cool
]
;W[kf]
;B[cc]C[Ootakamoku [?\]: how much thickness is needed to make the c17+double hanhe work?
]
;W[bc]
;B[bb]C[snowman [-\]: :)
Ootakamoku [?\]: the amount of aji from this looks so ridiculous if w decides to fight it
FinFinal [?\]: obviously antti has planned for this, while Namii didn't expect at all.
snowman [-\]: i think we don't use the word aji here
Ootakamoku [?\]: complications?
snowman [-\]: faito
Ootakamoku [?\]: :)
]
;W[cb]
;B[dc]
;W[ab]C[snowman [-\]: white chickened a little bit
]
;B[ba]
;W[be]
;B[db]C[Ootakamoku [?\]: depressing gote life
]
;W[de]
;B[ee]
;W[dd]C[Ootakamoku [?\]: l12? h3? e2?
Ootakamoku [?\]: q12?
]
;B[le]C[FinFinal [?\]: w reaction to this peep is quite important
Ootakamoku [?\]: j17?
FinFinal [?\]: just connect b will easily get lead
moro123 [1d\]: what else?
FinFinal [?\]: I'm considering M14
]
;W[ke]
;B[kh]C[MikGo [4d?\]: nice position for black
Werfeus [5d\]: i don't think there were any serious alternatives to L15
yulia [8k\]: hi where is the live stream?
FinFinal [?\]: ah well, we didn't get live stream work, guess will try again in the next game.
yulia [8k\]: ok
FinFinal [?\]: to me earlier M14 is possible. just like this it's easy to b.
Ootakamoku [?\]: just clamp the b stone?
]
;W[ne]C[FinFinal [?\]: this doesn't look like a good shape for w.
FinFinal [?\]: b will simply N17 to answer.
Ootakamoku [?\]: n17 n13?
FinFinal [?\]: then b m16
]
;B[mc]C[moro123 [1d\]: looks like an easy game for b
FinFinal [?\]: so far yes
]
;W[od]C[snowman [-\]: oh, horror
]
;B[pc]
;W[ld]C[Wirtuoosi [2d\]: q14 for b? or something faster?
]
;B[pg]C[Trumelunki [3d\]: I think we will soon see a big overplay. Like invasion at r11 or something
FinFinal [?\]: w has to take care of this group first though
Trumelunki [3d\]: Of course he should...
Wirtuoosi [2d\]: I don't like the idea of leaving weaknesses on both sides of this stone though, I'd rather leave just one bigger weakness
cxv: q13 does feel a bit loose even if w has a weak group - comments on it?
FinFinal [?\]: you mean b this move?
Trumelunki [3d\]: You would have preferred q14 ?
Wirtuoosi [2d\]: Trumelunki, yeah
FinFinal [?\]: to me this one is right, since R15 is not a problem.
moro123 [1d\]: works better with r9 I guess
Trumelunki [3d\]: The sequence is r15 q15 q16 p15 o16 r17 ?
Wirtuoosi [2d\]: with this I just think that it gives options for w
FinFinal [?\]: mostly, to give w this group pressure
FinFinal [?\]: trumelunki: yes
Prodigious [4d?\]: hard to see white winning this
Prodigious [4d?\]: maybe he'll show us some of the famous namii magic
]
;W[hc]C[FinFinal [?\]: prodi: is this what you meant? :P
Wirtuoosi [2d\]: this aims into getting j14 in sente?
FinFinal [?\]: no, he is aiming at E17 cut
Prodigious [4d?\]: something like this i guess
FinFinal [?\]: ok : )    this is definitely a crazy plan with w weak group there
Mokki [2d\]: w aiming at J14 sente in my opinion
FinFinal [?\]: well, then w will lose way too many points on the top.
Mokki [2d\]: j17 j14 h16 k12 k11 j12 
]
;B[hd]C[Mokki [2d\]: now w got a base :)
Mokki [2d\]: if he so desires
Ootakamoku [?\]: funny if he doesnt take the base tho
Ootakamoku [?\]: does e17 cut work now, if willing to get cuat at j17?
Mokki [2d\]: E17 is a huge gamble
cxv: Hello? Desperation time :)
Mokki [2d\]: but w is rock solid with every other group than L15
snowman [-\]: E17 cut variations are relatively easy to read
]
;W[ec]C[snowman [-\]: :)
cxv: When losing, gamble :)
Ootakamoku [?\]: g17?
Ootakamoku [?\]: oh, nvm, cant
]
;B[eb]C[FinFinal [?\]: b doesn't want to gamble. : )
Ootakamoku [?\]: f17 g16 and how does w contnue?
Wirtuoosi [2d\]: I guess losing corner stones in ko wasn't option
snowman [-\]: black would have lost H16/J16 stones if played atari F17
FinFinal [?\]: yes, just b could have chosen to sacrifice those corner stones, to attack w top right.
Ootakamoku [?\]: but where is the gain for w this way? I cant see any local move for w now
]
;W[fc]C[Ootakamoku [?\]: and if b plays g16 now.. w answer is what?
]
;B[gc]C[FinFinal [?\]: oota: w turn f18 and wins by one :P
Ootakamoku [?\]: g16 f18 g17 err.. I read that b wins by 1
Prodigious [4d?\]: read again
Ootakamoku [?\]: yup yup
FinFinal [?\]: :D
Ootakamoku [?\]: missed f19
]
;W[gb]
;B[gd]
;W[fb]C[snowman [-\]: wow
]
;B[hb]
;W[ib]C[Gardan [?\]: bold
FinFinal [?\]: w all in
]
;B[ic]
;W[ha]C[FinFinal [?\]: the thing is, w outside is not alive, and b can afford it even if top left may die.
]
;B[jb]C[Kettu [5d?\]: sometimes its surprisingly hard to differentiate desperation from fighting spirit :)
]
;W[fa]C[FinFinal [?\]: :D
]
;B[fd]C[jokkebk [-\]: fighting on the first line, where's my popcorn
]
;W[ea]
;B[ca]
;W[hc]
;B[da]
;W[kb]C[juna [1k\]: looks like better ko for black
]
;B[hb]C[snowman [-\]: this is slightly no no for white
]
;W[qe]C[Kettu [5d?\]: white lacks credible threats
Ootakamoku [?\]: j19
juna [1k\]: black take some big ko threat and be happy
]
;B[ia]C[juna [1k\]: corner can be sacrificed
Ootakamoku [?\]: juna, no big ko threats for black either
jokkebk [-\]: B16?
Kettu [5d?\]: yeah, but if b answers threats like R15, there are endless amounts of them
Kettu [5d?\]: so might as well not answer it right away
jokkebk [-\]: yep
jokkebk [-\]: when opponent plays a threat you can ignore...
FinFinal [?\]: so w cost huge on the top, to get 2 moves in a row on the right side.
FinFinal [?\]: seems like still w is in a hard situation
snowman [-\]: still no definite eyes :)
]
;W[pd]C[jokkebk [-\]: important especially in kyu games where there may be a 30 point ko and 40 point theats, but opponent starts with a 10pt one 
Kettu [5d?\]: yeah, still feels white is under attack
Kettu [5d?\]: even though 2 moves
FinFinal [?\]: cos the cost on the top side also takes away w potential eye shapes there
FinFinal [?\]: b 46 mins, w 19 mins left
]
;B[rd]
;W[qc]
;B[rc]
;W[qb]
;B[rb]
;W[qi]C[FinFinal [?\]: new gambling?
]
;B[pi]
;W[ph]C[jokkebk [-\]: right looks like white moyo with black invasion stones now :)
jokkebk [-\]: a moyo with paper walls, though
]
;B[oh]
;W[qh]
;B[pj]C[FinFinal [?\]: b feels winning, from his gesture
rasse [3k\]: dangerous feeling :)
FinFinal [?\]: :D
]
;W[og]C[jokkebk [-\]: "now I only need to avoid any new white territories forming to win"
]
;B[qg]C[FinFinal [?\]: ok I also missed this one
FinFinal [?\]: it may finish the game here.
jokkebk [-\]: S13 doesn't work?
FinFinal [?\]: b p14 atari, then hane s14
]
;W[rg]C[jokkebk [-\]: true
]
;B[of]
;W[ng]
;B[rf]
;W[sg]
;B[pe]C[FinFinal [?\]: I guess w has to resign now.
jokkebk [-\]: looks like the players demonstrated it for me...
FinFinal [?\]: b did quite well in general, only c12 is a bit questionable to me
FinFinal [?\]: w l16 was a decisive mistake on direction at the start
FinFinal [?\]: after that w was always struggling
FinFinal [?\]: B+R
FinFinal [?\]: 2nd game will be at 3:00pm, so in around 1.5 hours
Gardan [?\]: can w even capture p12?
Gardan [?\]: guess not
])
