(;GM[1]FF[4]CA[UTF-8]AP[CGoban:3]ST[2] RU[Japanese]SZ[19]KM[6.50] PW[Juri Kuronen]PB[Antti Törmänen]WR[5d]BR[6d]DT[2012-12-29]EV[Finnish Championship Final]RO[1]C[FinFinal [?\]: Olisiko kellään EuroGoTV-FI:n salasanaa ustreamiin? FinFinal [?\]: Juri saapui, kohta nigiir FinFinal [?\]: Kamerajärjestely ei näköjään toimi, joten se jää tänä vuonna väliin FinFinal [?\]: Peli starttaa oletettavasti 11:20 tai niillä main ] ;B[qd] ;W[cd] ;B[oc] ;W[qo] ;B[pq]C[snowman [-\]: 150 years old fuseki Gardan [?\]: antti on siis päässyt opiskelussaan jo niin pitkälle Ootakamoku [?\]: kummasta suunnasta se lähti liikkeelle opiskelussa? snowman [-\]: tosi kummasta... ] ;W[dp] ;B[qk] ;W[op] ;B[oq] ;W[np]C[dxxd [2k\]: veikkaan et tää päättyy 2,5 pisteen eroon ] ;B[mq]C[Ootakamoku [?\]: voiko valkonen tenukoida tässä kohtaa topleftiin? FinFinal [?\]: seems like w next move R3 is the must Ootakamoku [?\]: vai jääkö noi bottom right stemut liian heikoiks? ] ;W[qq] ;B[ed]C[dxxd [2k\]: jaha, jännä tenuki FinFinal [?\]: b tenuki is quite interesting. : ) dxxd [2k\]: r2 on iso ] ;W[nq] ;B[nr] ;W[mr] ;B[lr] ;W[or] ;B[ms]C[Ootakamoku [?\]: I dont see how w can be happy with this ] ;W[pr]C[FinFinal [?\]: w solid territory, but b mainly concerns about speed in the opening. FinFinal [?\]: the only problem is R9's position I think, since w bottom right corner is pretty strong. Ootakamoku [?\]: would it be too weird for b to play something like k16, instead of say.. c17? dxxd [2k\]: d14 a bit irritating for w but so is the next move at the bottom for b as well FinFinal [?\]: as I know about Antti, he won't do C17, but impossible to be K16 either. :P snowman [-\]: i expect something grand FinFinal [?\]: d14 is natural for b next Ootakamoku [?\]: d14 is good even with r9 weak? Wirtuoosi [2d\]: not sure if d14 is consistent with having low stone at p17 though, maybe extend from ponnuki? ] ;B[df]C[FinFinal [?\]: hehe, I know him more after all :P FinFinal [?\]: however, Oota's question is still valid. b this design is ambitious but risky, sure. Ootakamoku [?\]: what time settings do they have? FinFinal [?\]: 90 minutes main, plus 1 minute byoyomi FinFinal [?\]: for now b 82 minutes, w 71 minutes left FinFinal [?\]: I may directly go R11 if i were w ] ;W[cf]C[dxxd [2k\]: too bad attacking m2 group doesn't seem that effective, for example sequence starting from l3 seems lame atm ] ;B[dg] ;W[cg] ;B[dh]C[Ootakamoku [?\]: dxxd, w f3 is pretty strong against that black group, and nice I think. Ootakamoku [?\]: but not excacly the most urgent move Wirtuoosi [2d\]: seems Antti chose simple way to play here d13 Ootakamoku [?\]: wirtuoosi, the ladder breakers on the bottom side too much a burden if play hane instead of d13? FinFinal [?\]: to me w made choice on top left corner too early FinFinal [?\]: now b formation is strong ] ;W[kd]C[Wirtuoosi [2d\]: Ootakamoku, if I read correctly, o4 group already breaks the ladder Werfeus [5d\]: pitäiskö tapahtumaistaa tämä? Ootakamoku [?\]: oh.. I thought it hits the ponnuki, doh ] ;B[ch]C[snowman [-\]: L16 is like a white dwarf in black space Wirtuoosi [2d\]: dwarves can be dangerous with their axes dxxd [2k\]: now it looks good for b, w needs another move at the top to make l16 valid at all FinFinal [?\]: l16 was surely questionable, however b this turn is also kinda slow FinFinal [?\]: after b this turn, in the future it just makes b choice at bottom left harder. Ootakamoku [?\]: this weakens l16 a bit? since now b has forcing moves in topleft.. FinFinal [?\]: sure, however it's w move next Ootakamoku [?\]: hard to find a move for white tho.. dont want to ruin r11, dont want to play close to e16 since its already so very strong, topright corner solid.. Wirtuoosi [2d\]: those forcing moves also make w top left corner very low, not much points there and b will be very thick, so even if w spends move reinforcing l16, he doesn't have that much potential ] ;W[cn]C[Ootakamoku [?\]: b take the forcing moves in topleft, and then urm.. l14? m15? what? Wirtuoosi [2d\]: I was thinking j17 after them as follow up, make points and prevent w from making base Ootakamoku [?\]: wouldnt b j17 make c12 look bad? Wirtuoosi [2d\]: but lower side looks urgent to me now FinFinal [?\]: if I were b I'd C17 and nobi first, then J16 to attack FinFinal [?\]: so automatically fix R11 from this attacking Wirtuoosi [2d\]: sounds valid to me, my thinking is probably too territorial at the moment FinFinal [?\]: hehe, but I have no idea how players will decide. already a few surprising decisions ] ;B[id]C[Wirtuoosi [2d\]: j17 would allow w to j16 so j16 for b looks better FinFinal [?\]: mainly, high position to attack. : ) Ootakamoku [?\]: seems like alot of the value from c12 is the forcing moves in topleft to get thickness, but if extend to j16 then the forcing moves in topleft only have territorial value.. hence dont get c12 FinFinal [?\]: so b doesn't wanna exchange on top left, I'd guess b wanna reserve the possibility for attach C17 then double hane. snowman [-\]: antti wants to kill the corner later :) Wirtuoosi [2d\]: I guess I just thought w makes base too easily with j17 attachment Ootakamoku [?\]: oh, cool ] ;W[kf] ;B[cc]C[Ootakamoku [?\]: how much thickness is needed to make the c17+double hanhe work? ] ;W[bc] ;B[bb]C[snowman [-\]: :) Ootakamoku [?\]: the amount of aji from this looks so ridiculous if w decides to fight it FinFinal [?\]: obviously antti has planned for this, while Namii didn't expect at all. snowman [-\]: i think we don't use the word aji here Ootakamoku [?\]: complications? snowman [-\]: faito Ootakamoku [?\]: :) ] ;W[cb] ;B[dc] ;W[ab]C[snowman [-\]: white chickened a little bit ] ;B[ba] ;W[be] ;B[db]C[Ootakamoku [?\]: depressing gote life ] ;W[de] ;B[ee] ;W[dd]C[Ootakamoku [?\]: l12? h3? e2? Ootakamoku [?\]: q12? ] ;B[le]C[FinFinal [?\]: w reaction to this peep is quite important Ootakamoku [?\]: j17? FinFinal [?\]: just connect b will easily get lead moro123 [1d\]: what else? FinFinal [?\]: I'm considering M14 ] ;W[ke] ;B[kh]C[MikGo [4d?\]: nice position for black Werfeus [5d\]: i don't think there were any serious alternatives to L15 yulia [8k\]: hi where is the live stream? FinFinal [?\]: ah well, we didn't get live stream work, guess will try again in the next game. yulia [8k\]: ok FinFinal [?\]: to me earlier M14 is possible. just like this it's easy to b. Ootakamoku [?\]: just clamp the b stone? ] ;W[ne]C[FinFinal [?\]: this doesn't look like a good shape for w. FinFinal [?\]: b will simply N17 to answer. Ootakamoku [?\]: n17 n13? FinFinal [?\]: then b m16 ] ;B[mc]C[moro123 [1d\]: looks like an easy game for b FinFinal [?\]: so far yes ] ;W[od]C[snowman [-\]: oh, horror ] ;B[pc] ;W[ld]C[Wirtuoosi [2d\]: q14 for b? or something faster? ] ;B[pg]C[Trumelunki [3d\]: I think we will soon see a big overplay. Like invasion at r11 or something FinFinal [?\]: w has to take care of this group first though Trumelunki [3d\]: Of course he should... Wirtuoosi [2d\]: I don't like the idea of leaving weaknesses on both sides of this stone though, I'd rather leave just one bigger weakness cxv: q13 does feel a bit loose even if w has a weak group - comments on it? FinFinal [?\]: you mean b this move? Trumelunki [3d\]: You would have preferred q14 ? Wirtuoosi [2d\]: Trumelunki, yeah FinFinal [?\]: to me this one is right, since R15 is not a problem. moro123 [1d\]: works better with r9 I guess Trumelunki [3d\]: The sequence is r15 q15 q16 p15 o16 r17 ? Wirtuoosi [2d\]: with this I just think that it gives options for w FinFinal [?\]: mostly, to give w this group pressure FinFinal [?\]: trumelunki: yes Prodigious [4d?\]: hard to see white winning this Prodigious [4d?\]: maybe he'll show us some of the famous namii magic ] ;W[hc]C[FinFinal [?\]: prodi: is this what you meant? :P Wirtuoosi [2d\]: this aims into getting j14 in sente? FinFinal [?\]: no, he is aiming at E17 cut Prodigious [4d?\]: something like this i guess FinFinal [?\]: ok : ) this is definitely a crazy plan with w weak group there Mokki [2d\]: w aiming at J14 sente in my opinion FinFinal [?\]: well, then w will lose way too many points on the top. Mokki [2d\]: j17 j14 h16 k12 k11 j12 ] ;B[hd]C[Mokki [2d\]: now w got a base :) Mokki [2d\]: if he so desires Ootakamoku [?\]: funny if he doesnt take the base tho Ootakamoku [?\]: does e17 cut work now, if willing to get cuat at j17? Mokki [2d\]: E17 is a huge gamble cxv: Hello? Desperation time :) Mokki [2d\]: but w is rock solid with every other group than L15 snowman [-\]: E17 cut variations are relatively easy to read ] ;W[ec]C[snowman [-\]: :) cxv: When losing, gamble :) Ootakamoku [?\]: g17? Ootakamoku [?\]: oh, nvm, cant ] ;B[eb]C[FinFinal [?\]: b doesn't want to gamble. : ) Ootakamoku [?\]: f17 g16 and how does w contnue? Wirtuoosi [2d\]: I guess losing corner stones in ko wasn't option snowman [-\]: black would have lost H16/J16 stones if played atari F17 FinFinal [?\]: yes, just b could have chosen to sacrifice those corner stones, to attack w top right. Ootakamoku [?\]: but where is the gain for w this way? I cant see any local move for w now ] ;W[fc]C[Ootakamoku [?\]: and if b plays g16 now.. w answer is what? ] ;B[gc]C[FinFinal [?\]: oota: w turn f18 and wins by one :P Ootakamoku [?\]: g16 f18 g17 err.. I read that b wins by 1 Prodigious [4d?\]: read again Ootakamoku [?\]: yup yup FinFinal [?\]: :D Ootakamoku [?\]: missed f19 ] ;W[gb] ;B[gd] ;W[fb]C[snowman [-\]: wow ] ;B[hb] ;W[ib]C[Gardan [?\]: bold FinFinal [?\]: w all in ] ;B[ic] ;W[ha]C[FinFinal [?\]: the thing is, w outside is not alive, and b can afford it even if top left may die. ] ;B[jb]C[Kettu [5d?\]: sometimes its surprisingly hard to differentiate desperation from fighting spirit :) ] ;W[fa]C[FinFinal [?\]: :D ] ;B[fd]C[jokkebk [-\]: fighting on the first line, where's my popcorn ] ;W[ea] ;B[ca] ;W[hc] ;B[da] ;W[kb]C[juna [1k\]: looks like better ko for black ] ;B[hb]C[snowman [-\]: this is slightly no no for white ] ;W[qe]C[Kettu [5d?\]: white lacks credible threats Ootakamoku [?\]: j19 juna [1k\]: black take some big ko threat and be happy ] ;B[ia]C[juna [1k\]: corner can be sacrificed Ootakamoku [?\]: juna, no big ko threats for black either jokkebk [-\]: B16? Kettu [5d?\]: yeah, but if b answers threats like R15, there are endless amounts of them Kettu [5d?\]: so might as well not answer it right away jokkebk [-\]: yep jokkebk [-\]: when opponent plays a threat you can ignore... FinFinal [?\]: so w cost huge on the top, to get 2 moves in a row on the right side. FinFinal [?\]: seems like still w is in a hard situation snowman [-\]: still no definite eyes :) ] ;W[pd]C[jokkebk [-\]: important especially in kyu games where there may be a 30 point ko and 40 point theats, but opponent starts with a 10pt one Kettu [5d?\]: yeah, still feels white is under attack Kettu [5d?\]: even though 2 moves FinFinal [?\]: cos the cost on the top side also takes away w potential eye shapes there FinFinal [?\]: b 46 mins, w 19 mins left ] ;B[rd] ;W[qc] ;B[rc] ;W[qb] ;B[rb] ;W[qi]C[FinFinal [?\]: new gambling? ] ;B[pi] ;W[ph]C[jokkebk [-\]: right looks like white moyo with black invasion stones now :) jokkebk [-\]: a moyo with paper walls, though ] ;B[oh] ;W[qh] ;B[pj]C[FinFinal [?\]: b feels winning, from his gesture rasse [3k\]: dangerous feeling :) FinFinal [?\]: :D ] ;W[og]C[jokkebk [-\]: "now I only need to avoid any new white territories forming to win" ] ;B[qg]C[FinFinal [?\]: ok I also missed this one FinFinal [?\]: it may finish the game here. jokkebk [-\]: S13 doesn't work? FinFinal [?\]: b p14 atari, then hane s14 ] ;W[rg]C[jokkebk [-\]: true ] ;B[of] ;W[ng] ;B[rf] ;W[sg] ;B[pe]C[FinFinal [?\]: I guess w has to resign now. jokkebk [-\]: looks like the players demonstrated it for me... FinFinal [?\]: b did quite well in general, only c12 is a bit questionable to me FinFinal [?\]: w l16 was a decisive mistake on direction at the start FinFinal [?\]: after that w was always struggling FinFinal [?\]: B+R FinFinal [?\]: 2nd game will be at 3:00pm, so in around 1.5 hours Gardan [?\]: can w even capture p12? Gardan [?\]: guess not ])